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459: Wendy Doris

Introduction and Listener Celebration

Sarah Karakaian: [00:00:00] Hello. Welcome back to another [00:01:00] great episode. My name is Sarah Karakaian.

Annette Grant: I’m Annette Grant, and together we are Thanks for Visiting.

Let’s start

Sarah Karakaian: this episode like we do every week, and that is celebrating one of you our incredible listeners. We are heading on over to t share.com, entering all the information you can about your short-term rental, so we can share you here on the podcast and on Instagram every single Sunday.

Who are we sharing this week?

Spotlight on Duck Pond A-Frame

Annette Grant: This week we are sharing at Duck Pond A-Frame. Again, that’s at duck, DUCK, pond A-Frame, and it is hosted by our wonderful guest of the show today. Wendy Doris. It is one of her own properties in her portfolio. And I wanna start a healthy debate. When you go to Duck Pond, A-Frame, you might go, but wait, she’s gonna be so mad.

Is that an A-frame? And to that, I say. It is because I was just doing some drawings for Sarah and I can draw an A like this [00:02:00] too with a flat roof. That’s right. Um, it is an A-frame and it is interesting, so I want you to check it out.

Meet Wendy Doris: Design and Hosting Expertise

Annette Grant: And I really want you to take a look at, one of the reasons Sarah and I started following Wendy on Instagram years and years ago before we met her in person, before she was a coach in our program, is she just has amazing design.

She has a special skill set for that and she’s was a house flipper and you can just see these elements, um, and a thrifter and she does it in a really wonderful way. And please go to her Instagram, check it Duck Pond a-frame out. Also, her personal Instagram, well, not personal, whole business at most is host, most host.

But the biggest thing I want to share is just looking through her social. You’ll see the angles of the photos that she takes to really highlight, uh. Home, and we talk about this often, but they’re not your normal real estate photos. So I want you to take a look at the angles at [00:03:00] what she’s highlighting and you can copy that in your own feed of what you’re showing to the guests.

Sarah Karakaian: Yeah. Wendy is a masterclass in details, and you’ll hear us in the, in the episode today, she talks about her quote unquote rabbit holes. ’cause I, I, we talk to Wendy all the time ’cause she’s a coach in our program. And ’cause I’m always interested in what she’s focusing on in her business. ’cause she’ll get hyper-focused on one area and like just become an expert at it.

And then she’ll give it to a team member of hers as their project and have them develop it into her co-hosting business. And it’s just really interesting to watch. So Wendy started Mostess in 2018 with her sister Ashley. Wendy and Ashley. You were our former elite and NCAA gymnasts. So she always is a.

Called herself a self self-proclaimed perfectionist, and they’ve channeled that perfectionism in the stays that she offers her guests. And so she co-hosts in a very [00:04:00] competitive market, Phoenix, Scottsdale. She’s up to what, 17, 18 properties now. Um, and she’s very selective, so she’s not a co-host who is out there trying to get as big as possible.

She is steady Eddie, and really focusing on. Revenue and making sure that she’s optimizing every single home’s revenue. Could this quality over quantity for Wendy. And of course we are promoting money making May with our priced and profitable bootcamp that you all can join us on. But we know that when it comes to pricing, we might need to do a little bit of.

Convincing that it can be fun because making money is fun, and so oftentimes, Annette and I can tell you, but you sometimes need to hear it from one of your colleagues like Wendy, on how she’s made pricing fun and how it’s really changed her business.

Wendy’s Journey in Revenue Management

Sarah Karakaian: Wendy, welcome back to the show. Wendy, you’re becoming as [00:05:00] frequent as Justin Ford. How does that make you feel?

Wendy Doris: Well, I love it and it’s very exciting to talk about the rabbit holes that I create for myself. So you give me like this avenue to do that. So thank you actually.

Annette Grant: So if you had to give your you two minute who you are if you’re out and about in Phoenix, Scottsdale area and somebody wants to know what you do mm-hmm. What’s your elevator pitch?

Wendy Doris: I say that we manage, um, for, usually for owners outside of the state, um, homes in Phoenix, Scottsdale, and other areas of Arizona. And typically they are experiential homes.

Sarah Karakaian: You don’t mention how you’re a sought after coach instead of the Hosting Business Mastery presented by Thanks for visiting.

Wendy Doris: Well, that just tips me over the edge right. When, um, you know, trying to reel in that owner. Right, right, right. Got it.

Sarah Karakaian: Wendy. Today. So it is, it is going to be money making May over here at, thanks for visiting. Um, we’re recording this in April, but we’ve got a bootcamp that we’re gonna be [00:06:00] hosting here in May, and we thought it’d be a perfect opportunity to bring in a host the mostest host, and talk about your journey with pricing.

So. Could you take us back to when you first started hosting, share with everyone, when that was, what that looked like, and then layer on what was pricing like for you? Was it top of mind, was it an afterthought? And then we’ll take it from there.

Wendy Doris: Sure. Um, I, my first, the first time I hosted was like in 2010 or something, but it was one time.

And then for real, I started in 2000. 16, I think. No, 18, 2018. And I was basically just creating the pricing. I don’t know if people start like this still, maybe they are using, um, pricing software, but I was just literally saying the weekends are this price and the weekdays are this price. And then maybe I would know it’s high [00:07:00] season and so, hey, let’s try this price.

Right? Just like winging it. And then I think, I don’t, I don’t remember when, um, Airbnb had their price. What is that thing called? I don’t even know. Smart pricing. Smart pricing. Mm-hmm. Yeah, that, I don’t know when that came about, but I think I tried that once. And we were managing a condo in Cincinnati actually, and it was brand new.

Um, it’s a loft downtown, so great. And it made the pricing $14 a night and

Sarah Karakaian: Airbnb’s smart pricing did?

Wendy Doris: Yeah. Okay. So I was like off, turn that off quick. Um, and so.

Dynamic Pricing: Tools and Strategies

Wendy Doris: I don’t know how it came up with that pricing, but I gave up on that and then eventually I found Price Labs, which I use now to still to this day.

And um, yeah, so I guess then I just trusted Price Labs to do everything for me for a little while. But then I like to have control. I know what the prices should be in some cases, you know, obviously we can be [00:08:00] surprised. Um, but I started to tinker with the pricing of individual dates when I knew it might be need to be higher, a little bit lower, um, or wanted to test.

So I guess, and then I fell into the revenue management, um, rabbit hole. So, uh, that’s where I’m at right now is just obsessing over reports and, um, yeah, obsessing.

Annette Grant: Revenue management. Let’s just take that term, period. Okay.

Wendy Doris: Wait, wait. This is my question I have for you. Yeah, yeah. Oh. What is re revenue management to you guys?

Because I think when we talk to our hosts in our, um, HBM, that to them it’s pricing.

Sarah Karakaian: Hmm.

Wendy Doris: Right. Um, and to me, I had to think about that and even Google it before this because there’s so many different aspects of it. But I wanted to know what your, what’s your definition? A good. Revenue management.

Sarah Karakaian: I was gonna say, I was gonna combat that a little bit.

We talked to host two, Wendy, you do as well. Instead of HBM, if, if it’s not quote [00:09:00] unquote pricing, it’s their bookkeeping that they think is revenue management, right? They’re like, well, yeah, I’ve got a bookkeeper. And so revenue, what is, what? Revenue management to me is how we optimize our opportunities to bring in income.

I don’t wanna use revenue again, since it’s in the. The word you’re asking me for, um, how we optimize and allocate our potential for income that’s coming into the business now. I think a big sector of that is pricing. Uh, but then there’s opportunities within like a subsets of pricing where we can bring in more opportunity, like gap nights and, uh, different opportunities to come in early or stay later things, things of that nature.

But what does it mean to you now?

Wendy Doris: After I Googled it, I agreed with Google and it was, um, it said something about your strategy, strategy for, um, creating the best income situation. Well, I could probably still have it [00:10:00] up if you want me to read it, but, um, I do not. But yeah, this, it’s the Strat I think it’s the strategy you’re taking because yes, you can say, I want this.

Price to be on this date and this price to be on this date. But then like, how many days are we going to allow people to book? Is it gonna be a minimum of two nights or four nights or, um, so there’s different strategies we can do, um, to, to boost our income and reach the highest potential.

Sarah Karakaian: Wendy, you tried the smart pricing on Airbnb.

It had one wild number, so you were like, I don’t trust this anymore. You turned it off. At what point though did you, did you get Price Labs, which is a dynamic pricing software, which helps you optimize pricing and your strategy. It doesn’t do it for you, but it helps you optimize it. Were, did you get it Just ’cause everyone, everyone else was doing it.

You went to a conference, you thought it was cool. Like what was that moment where you were like, I can’t do this on my own anymore and I [00:11:00] should get software?

Wendy Doris: I wanna say maybe it was when I joined HBM, um. Or maybe I was listening to Thanks for Visiting something, I was probably influenced by the fact that other people are doing this.

There’s algorithm, there’s like, there’s an algorithm behind it and I don’t have, but mostly it was, I was, I think it was at about five properties and I can’t, I can’t keep track of all the days anymore. Mm-hmm. You know, the calendar’s still running and for me to. Pay attention to April, 2026 right now on all five.

Well, now we have more, but all five properties and make sure that these special weekends are, um, boosted where they should be. It was, it was impossible.

Sarah Karakaian: Yeah. I wanna, and then

Wendy Doris: like, sorry, I was just gonna say some that sometimes something would book that it was ridiculously low. Mm,

Annette Grant: mm-hmm.

Wendy Doris: Maybe it, I, I didn’t realize it was a holiday or a special event or something like that.

So. [00:12:00] Yeah, I stopped that real quick

Annette Grant: that I, I want to slow down also, and this.

Challenges and Realizations in Pricing

Annette Grant: Episode is for everyone. This is if you, um, have one property, if it’s part-time, your personal property, if you want to buy more properties. I think a lot of times I do. Going back to the term revenue management, I do think a lot of people think that it’s not for them because of the their, um.

Size of their portfolio or the size of their property. And I just want to encourage everyone that it doesn’t matter what you are hosting, you need to be aware, and that needs to be a part of a part of your hosting because I think it’s a rite of passage, Wendy, what you just said. Every host has had that gut punch.

Oh my gosh, did that just get booked? I didn’t have a chance to [00:13:00] change the price, and I think that’s that aha moment when we all kind of go, wait, I need help with this. Whether it’s a person on their team, whether it’s dynamic pricing software, but every, I mean, just this week Sarah and I have talked to people that have.

Bookings for things that are a year out that they weren’t quick enough, you know, to the guest was quicker than them, saw an opportunity in the market. They, they were underpriced and booked it. So that is, there is such a huge cost to not understanding it because, um, or, or putting it off because like you said, the calendar is open and as a host you’re always busy doing something and this isn’t something you can put off to another day because guests are gonna continue to book those dates that you haven’t had a chance to.

Um. Make sure that they’re properly managed with the pricing.

Sarah Karakaian: Wendy, what? Okay. We spend so much time underwriting a potential property as hosts, right when we go to buy the property. And then [00:14:00] these houses, more often than not cost, I mean upwards of 400, 500, 600, 800, a million dollars depending on where you’re at in the world.

Yet once we acquire it. I feel as if the conversations I have aren’t about squeezing all the juice out of the potential revenue opportunities for these rentals. Do you find that to be true? And if so, what do you think is behind that?

Wendy Doris: I think once somebody launches a property, they’re so sick of spending money, like they’ve just dropped a lot of money.

Buying the house, outfitting the house. Um. You know, probably feeling sick about how much time, many times they’ve used their credit card. That to spend more money on something like dynamic pricing or even photos. Mm-hmm. I mean, we’ve talked about that. Like people won’t spend money on photos when that is your advertisement.

So, um, I think that’s where people get, um, [00:15:00] held back and. So, and then they wanna have control of, I think they wanna have control and to have a dynamic pricing software. Just running the, the show behind the scenes is a little bit, i, I, I think I’ve heard from some of our hosts that that’s a little bit unnerving for them.

Mm-hmm. Like, wait, wait a minute. It’s putting the price that high. Are you gonna cap it? ’cause that’s too high and we have to sell? Say no, no, no. Back off. Back off a little bit. So I, I think it’s the money

Annette Grant: that’s, well, I think it’s a fear of both. It’s, I think, um, it’s both what you just said. People are like, okay, we gotta just pump the brakes on the spending.

I need to get some money coming in the other way. And then also, if they are using a tool, sometimes the, the price. Is like mind boggling in a, in a great way to a host. And they start to get nervous of that, that perceived value that the guest is gonna have. It challenges them as a host of like, wow, am I gonna be able [00:16:00] to, um.

Like deliver, deliver on this rate that, uh, that the pricing is, um, telling me that I can get for my property. So I feel like as hosts, we a lot of times hold ourselves back, um, in just the overall economy of what we’re placing the value or perceived value on, on our home. One thing when you started to dive into the pricing.

Because I wanna dig into it really is the gift that keeps on giving. So what, when you started to dig into the pricing, when did you start to feel it or see it in your bottom line? When did you make that like connection that, oh, I am making an effort here with time, tools, money. You started to see it, um, on the bottom line.

’cause I do think that’s another thing too, when people start to, uh, they think that pricing is one and done and there should be instant results. So I wanna set like a, a, a, um, [00:17:00] realistic for folks that this isn’t like a set it and forget it done. Even if they have a pricing tool, even if they have someone on their team.

Um, those timelines and the work that’s involved in it. Good work though.

Wendy Doris: One thing I wanna preface this by saying is that I don’t know exactly when, like. Did our revenue go up by X percent or whatever? And one of the reasons I didn’t know is I didn’t, I didn’t know how to pull reports then when I first started dynamic pricing.

So it’s hard for me to, I could probably go back and and figure that out. We’ve also changed different houses that we have now, but one, the moment I realized that this was a good move was when I realized that I had been under pricing April by a lot. So it was, but just realizing, and this was something I was gonna get to was sometimes the price has to be higher, but sometimes it has to be lower and, and I’ve seen it with myself and with other hosts.

Like April is still high season for us. But there was a [00:18:00] couple of years that I didn’t realize that I thought, oh, spring. ’cause I’m in Phoenix, we have spring training. It’s over end of March, I thought, oh, that’s it. Everyone leaves. Nope, there’s still Spring train. Or Spring break. Easter. Mm-hmm. All these different, um, you know, travel reasons to come here.

And so we were leaving money on the table for a whole month, not just one weekend.

Annette Grant: Give us an example of that Underearning. You know, when you,

Wendy Doris: oh. Thousands of dollars. Thousands. So let’s say a typical home might bring in 16 to 20, like a four bedroom, 16 to $20,000 in March. Um, April would be not that high.

But maybe it’s gonna be 12 to 16. I think we were down to 10. I don’t know. Wow. I don’t remember, but I remember it was like, what? Wait, what?

Sarah Karakaian: And how’d you find out? Was it talking to their hosts or was it because your software told you, Hey, this is the suggested pricing. You were like, how can this be? And you dug in.

Wendy Doris: I think I saw the prices. [00:19:00] They were like, remember I was manually putting the prices on the weekends and I saw the prices that Price Labs was suggesting. Yeah. I was like, what the heck? Like I felt horrible that I’ve been doing this. Um, and just, you know, going by what I thought I should price things at rather than like the data.

Sarah Karakaian: Right.

Wendy Doris: Um, so that was one thing that I noticed. The other is, um, and I noticed this with another host, um, in my area. Pricing manually, pricing things for the summer, which is our lowest season. It’s like our, your winter, a weekday for let’s say $700, when it should be 200.

Sarah Karakaian: Mm-hmm.

Wendy Doris: So obviously the $700 is not gonna move at all.

Right? Yeah. We can’t make money unless we book houses. So, um, there’s the flip side of that where you think it should be worth something and it’s not. Mm-hmm. It’s not worth that. [00:20:00] Um, so I think that’s another thing that some hosts get, like, yes, there’s the one side where I can’t believe it could book for that high, but there’s the other side that’s like, oh, my house is not worth that much.

Like the ADR R is not that high.

Sarah Karakaian: I love that you’re bringing this up, Wendy. You’ll see in our bootcamp, uh, that we created three avatars that you follow along the whole journey of the bootcamp. And there’s host a, host B, and host C host a. She only focuses on a booked out calendar. Occupancy is her guiding star.

If she’s got a low occupancy, something’s, you know what I mean? Like she’s like trying to get as high occupancy as possible. Then MI has host B who thinks his property is worth X amount of dollar, like a large amount, no matter the supply to be no matter what. Yeah, he put his heart and soul into this property and you are going to pay handsomely to stay there no matter what.

And then we have host C who really. Focuses on strategy IE revenue management, and it’s this balance of understanding high season, low season travel patterns, things of that [00:21:00] nature. And so, and that is talking about the art and science of it. We do believe in a software, a third party software because we as humans cannot, uh, take in information and spit it out as fast as.

Software can. Right? Reading those algorithms and helping us understand it and digest it into data that we can do something with is something that we’ll never be able to compete with as humans. But starting out a Price Labs account and then just signing off and never signing back in is also not a great way to run your revenue management strategy.

So, Wendy, now that, so you went through this, the phase of doing pricing manually. You tried Airbnb smart pricing that didn’t work for you. You heard somewhere that using. Dynamic pricing software. Like from,

Annette Grant: we’ll take it, we’ll take it. We that it,

Sarah Karakaian: it would be good. Um, when did you start realizing that you have to kind of massage the software and be involved in it?

Wendy Doris: Um, well I did like doing the pricing, like I liked going through and [00:22:00] making sure it was what it was. And so I, I couldn’t help but pick at it. And, um, luckily I, um, was, I learned that yes. There are, you know, it can set, it can produce these prices for you, but there will be some error. You know, like, I know my properties better than, it’s not, my property’s not the same as everybody else’s, you know, all the properties that are out there in Scottsdale.

So, um, there is some tweaking to do to find that, um, that balance or that, that area where. You know, you can book once you’re com once you’re confident, right? So I will still go in there, I’ll look at the market, I will look at the market occupancy. Is there, um, is the ocu, is the occupancy really high? And so we can still wait and, um, because there’s still mo room.

So I love picking at the numbers like that. [00:23:00] And um, you know, seeing what we can do.

Sarah Karakaian: How often are you in there picking at numbers?

Weekly Revenue Management Routine

Wendy Doris: At least once a week. Every Wednesday I have a, um, a mo a time when I go over the numbers, but just about every day I pull, um, an on the books report and try to make sure I’m follow, like, we’re reaching our goals or where are we still having holes in?

Still going in, not just relying on price lots, but I go, um, into Airbnb and try promotions and rule sets and all the different levers we can pull to try to, um, you know, maximize the income for the owners.

Annette Grant: Wendy, I want you to share, though, ’cause you did say daily, you’re managing how many properties right now, just to give the, the audience an idea.

Wendy Doris: 17,

Annette Grant: 17. So I just want everyone that’s listening. I don’t want you to think that you need to be in there, [00:24:00] um, on a, a daily basis looking at your, um, pricing. But

Sarah Karakaian: I think even for one property.

Weekly is healthy. If you think about it, not just the whole like one property versus 17. Mm-hmm. That one property. If that’s a $500,000 investment, don’t you want to make, whatever your pro forma said you should make, don’t you wanna at least reach that or surpass it with your efforts? So it’s kinda like your own bank account, you know, your personal banking.

I don’t think you need to be in there every day. Looking at your, your bank account every week, make sure everything’s in there, everything’s moving as it should. There’s no weird charges. I think that’s really healthy and that I’d like to promote more of. Looking at your pricing and making sure everything is on par, which is why we’re doing money making may with this bootcamp priced and profitable, but, okay.

Understanding the On-the-Books Report

Sarah Karakaian: So Wendy, talk to us about the on the books report that you pull, what does that tell you and what do you do with that information?

Wendy Doris: It tells me, um. What revenue we have [00:25:00] booked right now for every month of the year. So, um, on Price Labs, you can set up your own per your own report. And so I have several diff different ones that I look at, but on this one it has, um, you know, the, the monthly goal, or I’m sorry, the monthly income that’s on the books.

And then what the occupancy, what is right now, what it was last year, what, what it was. Well, what, what did it end up at last year and what’s it at right now? Wait, same time last year? Mm-hmm. Right, sorry. Um, and then I have uploaded goals into there, so then we can compare the goal for each property and where, how close we are to that.

But one of the things I really like about the, on the books Go, um, on the books report is that it’s showing me the income only for each month of those days in the month, [00:26:00] rather than, oh, this booking checked in, or this guest checked in the 29th, but they’re staying through the seventh. So sometimes we can, um, our numbers can look a little bit skewed.

Mm-hmm. You’re looking at it just like, oh, we had the deposit in this month, but now we show no income for the first seven days of next month. So it’s a really good way to just see like, what’s happening this month and what’s same, what happened with the same dates last year, if that makes sense. So, I don’t know, I can get really deep into it, um, down these rabbit holes of.

Numbers and data and

Annette Grant: well, but that’s okay.

The Importance of Learning Pricing Skills

Annette Grant: But I want to, um, you know, the purpose, uh, of this, of all of our episodes always is to educate hosts out there. And we have just seen Wendy through, um, you know, our private membership through our hosting hotlines, through our Instagram account, through YouTube that.

Host, we believe you are Underearning, and that Underearning [00:27:00] is coming from a resistance to understanding your pricing and taking the time to. I’m gonna say this to learn the skill, and I, I’m, and I repeat, I’m saying learning the skill. I’m not saying mastering the skill, I’m just saying learning the skill and understanding it because we, that is, that is why we’re putting on this bootcamp, is we know that there will be.

I mean, even if you have one takeaway, one aha moment of understanding your A DR, your occupancy, the demand in your market, your booking window, maybe installing that dynamic pricing software. I also think as hosts, we try to take. Everything on. And it’s, it’s, it’s a, if you’re, I know all of our personality types ta talking right now.

Like we wanna go all in all the time and do it to the top notch. And so there’s some things that [00:28:00] we just don’t do because it’s easier to not do them or face them. And so that’s why we’re doing this bootcamp to bring lock arm, like link arms with everyone. Whether they feel like they’re, they’ve got their pricing down.

There’s always room for improvement if you don’t know where you’re at starting there. And last but not least, just as a community bringing all the hosts together. Because that’s the other part too, is we all need for priced and profitable as a community. Like a community is at large as a Airbnb hosting community and then community smaller in the areas that you’re in.

It’s important that our hosts, that we’re competitive and that we’re, we’re pricing our properties, accordingly. Because at the end of the day, we all win when we’re pricing appropriately. The guest is getting an amazing stay of course. But that’s the one thing I just really want, um, everyone listening to this episode is please.

Like Sarah said, we’ve invested so much [00:29:00] time and energy into the asset overall, the design of it, the hospitality of it. And so now we want you to focus on that pricing on like what is that price displayed when people are scrolling through, um, whether it’s. An OTA or direct booking. And we all know right now, like there’s pricing transparency is the, the buzzword right now.

And so it’s even more important that you understand your pricing, are confident in your pricing, and have that comp set. Um, available to you also. So I just wanna encourage everyone that the, the message that Wendy is saying, and this isn’t something that you’re gonna master overnight, it’s a part of learning and growing as a host and continuing, um, your education there.

So, Wendy, when you have.

Community Support and Bootcamp Benefits

Annette Grant: Let’s talk about our bootcamp. Let’s talk about learning alongside Sarah and I and learning inside of, uh, with other hosts because we are gonna have a private [00:30:00] Facebook group available. We’re gonna have VIP where they can have, um, zoom calls after the bootcamps to ask individual questions.

Can you also just give a, a clue into when you started to link arms with other hosts and inside our community what that did for your hosting Also.

Wendy Doris: Well, the, the Facebook group for sure is great because it’s very, um, productive. It’s not one of those groups that’s, you know, biting each other’s heads off.

So, um, you can really just get a lot done from the community in the Facebook group. But my favorite part are the calls, um, especially when you get to talk with the other hosts, um, or when you get to be one-on-one with you guys and ask them questions because. You just realize that there are a lot of ways to do something and you can get so many ideas and a hosting bestie where you can, um, I mean, I talk to my hosting besties that I’ve met through HBM [00:31:00] every day, every single day I talk to them.

So, um, it’s, it’s lonely being a business owner sometimes. And to be able to have those other business owners that are then can say, you know, just let it go. That that guest did that, or whatever. Walk it off or like, you need to do your, you need to do revenue management. Come on. Suck it up. It’s, it’s good to have those people to help you with it.

Annette Grant: Awesome. And I wanna encourage everyone, if you’ve been listening to. To the show for a while. That’s also why Sarah and I started doing these bootcamps, is it’s a very affordable way to connect with other hosts. That Facebook group is gonna be a pop-up group open for a few weeks. You’re gonna be able to learn directly from Sarah and I, um, for, for the bootcamp.

And like we said, there’s an opportunity to, um. Upgrade to VIP where we will go in depth after the bootcamp and answer those questions if you wanna take that next step. But I just encourage everyone, if you’ve been listening to the show for a while, um, the, the bootcamp and the [00:32:00] actual like being, um. With us on Zoom is a whole nother level.

So do yourself a favor. Invest, invest in yourself. Uh, again, I know how much you’ve all invested in your homes. I want you to do a challenge of how much have you invested in yourself to learn how to, to manage your home, um, to the utmost

Sarah Karakaian: obviously, setting your pricing to where it needs to be. And then we’ll go over that in the bootcamp.

How to really understand what. What the different, uh, benchmarks of pricing we need, what they are, um, how to hit them and how to look at them. But also, Wendy, you schooled us at the beginning of what their definition of revenue management is. And it’s not just pricing, it is also calendar management. And I think that’s a lot of times we see our hosts too, kind of blocking the traveler from traveling how they want to travel, which means they don’t stay with you because you don’t allow those, those, those types of stays.

So.

Calendar Management Strategies

Sarah Karakaian: Anything that you can comment on calendar management that you’ve learned over the years, [00:33:00]

Wendy Doris: yes. This is another one that’s like, oh no, you don’t do that. But now we do. It’s, you know, something that was in my mind that everyone says, no, you do not offer one night stays. We, our calendar has one night’s all over it now.

Mm-hmm. So, um, it helps with visibility. Uh, there’s a number of reasons in different markets and different. Types of houses that might benefit from this. But that’s another thing, like doing this work, talking to other hosts, you real, like you can learn that you’ve been getting in your own way.

Annette Grant: Ooh, that’s, that’s it.

Getting in your own way. And I think that with your

Wendy Doris: assumptions. Mm-hmm. Right? Instead of using the data so

Annette Grant: you know, you know what happens when you assume.

Wendy Doris: I do.

Annette Grant: Okay. Everybody knows that one. Oh my gosh. But I wanna, actually, I wanna say it for every, for the people in the back, what you just said about the one night stays, we are still, [00:34:00] still, like, again, I think it’s goes in this order, perf people still not having professional photography.

And then second of all, having these insane, minimum night stays. So we go and look at their calendar and we’re like, well. You don’t have any nights to book this month because you’ve got three weekends and you want a day before to clean. You want a day after to clean. Your cleaning lady is gonna come on Sunday and you only want four nights, days.

So it’s like you’re, you’re, again, you’re your own worst enemy. Well, actually, they’re never.

Wendy Doris: Getting to look at your calendar. Right? Right here, I’m popping up.

Sarah Karakaian: Right. And that if you ever, like, sometimes I, I like to go to page 15 and 16 on Airbnb just to see who’s over there. And sometimes I’ll see a beautiful property and I’m like, why are they over here?

You know what I mean? It’s just because maybe they, I have flexible stays on and like, so maybe I could say them if I move my dates around, but Right. You might not be being showing up because you’re not available to be booked, which is crazy to,

Wendy Doris: right, right. And I don’t know if we’re gonna get to this too, but.

There’s other pricing things we can see on price [00:35:00] labs like,

Sarah Karakaian: like

Wendy Doris: cleaning fees,

Sarah Karakaian: Ooh, mm-hmm.

Wendy Doris: And amenities. So we include that. Is that revenue management?

Sarah Karakaian: Yeah, I think it is absolutely anything. ’cause listen, the how the guest, how we make money is the guest booking with us. So if our fees are outta whack. Or they book with us and our fees are underearning.

And so then we, we don’t have our oxygen mask on and we can’t actually be in business because we can’t pay our bills because we haven’t paid attention and we feel like someone would never pay that price. Or we feel like it’s the cleaning fee that’s throwing guests off. But secretly it’s your stay requirements.

You know what I mean? Like it’s, it’s those things where if we don’t know what we’re looking at or how to take that information and process it, it can, it can hold us back.

Annette Grant: The other part, Wendy, I wanna share with the listeners, um, is just getting into your listing. That’s another thing is like people doing the set it and forget it on all the things.

So when Sarah and I go in and we’re going behind the scenes on people’s [00:36:00] listings, we noticed they have things, they have rule sets that were from when they first started and they were like, oh my gosh, I didn’t even know I still had that. Turned on, whether that’s inside Price Labs, whether that’s in Airbnb, like there are things they’ve just like they’ve gotten away from their listing and they go in and they’re like.

Like that was literally from when I set up my listing. I forgot I even had that, you know, in there. What share with us one of your biggest, um, goof ups when it comes to your pricing or your calendar so someone else can learn from your mistakes besides underpricing an entire month. Sorry.

Wendy Doris: Um, I would say that one of the things that gets me in trouble.

Promotions and Revenue Management

Wendy Doris: Because of my rabbit hole tendencies is to just like go to town on Airbnb promos or whatever. And then, you know, I’m still tinkering with things in Price Labs, which is going to affect direct bookings, but not Airbnb because they’ve got the promos running. So just going hog wild with the [00:37:00] promos or the rule sets or whatever, and then forgetting I did that.

And then something people don’t know is that promos don’t. Discount on the, on the pricing for Pro Airbnb promos does not reflect the true percentage discount of what the current price is. So if you’re saying, I’m gonna give 20% discount, it’s not on what you have the prices set at right now. It’s some, I don’t, I don’t remember how they do it, but, um, so anyway, setting all those things up and then not documenting it somewhere.

To go back and say, oh yeah, go check to see if that promo worked, and take it off if it didn’t, or try something different. So I limit myself, like I, I can’t go more than one month out for promos. I won’t allow myself to do it.

Annette Grant: I, I wanna, this is a highly debated subject. Some people love promos, some people don’t like promos.

Uh, some people are probably listening, going, what the heck is a promo? When, when did you get hip and when did you decide that promos were healthy and a good [00:38:00] decision for your business? I

Wendy Doris: think I’ve always played with them, but now I primarily use them for, um.

Maybe troubled time, troubled areas of the calendar. But we are, we are gonna book our weekends. That’s just what we do. It’s the weekdays that are tougher. So I will tinker with it for the weekdays where there’s, um, I don’t know. I have a little bit of a trust issue with Airbnb promos because I feel like it’s almost like whatever that other thing was, um, that made it $14.

So I’m like tread lightly and, uh. Keep an eye on it, but yeah, I, I use it for weekdays mostly, and then maybe like a, a random, like maybe July is not booking and I need to hurry it up, so I’ll try it on July, let’s say. I’m doing that right now. So I said a month out, but sometimes I break my rules.

Annette Grant: I was like, wait a second.

Sarah Karakaian: We just went over.

Annette Grant: I

Sarah Karakaian: know, I get it. [00:39:00] No, I get it. I get it. And, and you have to have rules so that you know when you know, you know when you need to break them to, to, to hit your goals. ’cause you are paying attention, which isn’t the segue into the next part. Next question for you, Wendy, is this bootcamp is for owner operators.

If you own your property, you are hosting them yourselves. It is for you. It is also for those co-hosts out there. If you’re just getting started, if you’ve been in business for a couple years, because Wendy, you and I see co-hosts all the time inside of hosting Business Mastery in our private Facebook group, and owners have trusted one of their largest assets, if not the largest asset they have with co-hosts who are in there also managing the pricing.

And they don’t have a revenue management strategy. They don’t have a pricing strategy. And so do you. Because you have such a deep understanding of pricing and calendar management and just your revenue management as a whole, is that something that you brag about to potential clients, potential [00:40:00] owners who wanna work with you about how you have your act together and what that means for their assets?

Wendy Doris: Yes. I actually do a revenue management consul consultation, um, weekly just to have other eyes on it with me. Um, because even I could be too close to it sometimes. Um, so I tell my owners, um, that I do weekly revenue manage management consultation. We are looking at your house at least once a week, if not multiple times a week.

And, um, so I think that, you know, helps them understand that we’re not just winging it, right? Like we’re professional and we are using data. But it also helps when, um, an owner is saying. Are we gonna, are we gonna raise prices this year? Because I’d really like to raise prices. And I say, actually, we already have, and your base rate was this last year and now the base rate is this, this much, and your a DR has [00:41:00] gone up and whatever.

But I can give data to back why we have booked at what we booked or why we’re setting it at a certain thing. So, um, it does help with, um. Managing the owners, I dunno if that’s the right word. Having the

Sarah Karakaian: owners trust you too. I feel right. Yeah. I think a lot of co-hosts get started, me included, because I love me.

I love the. All the systems that are in place and like when they work, it’s like very satisfying. Uh, you might, you might get started because you love helping other people earn five star reviews or communicating. The guests are going above and beyond. I don’t know too many co-hosts that get started because they love managing revenue.

I’m sure you are out there. I haven’t met you yet. Please email us and introduce yourself, but. To that. I say, if you’re a co-host listing right now, or you’re interested in co-hosting and you don’t have a strategy for managing revenue, you’ve gotta get on that because listen, a lot of co-host work off of [00:42:00] commission, your owners obviously want to have their asset be profitable, and so the thing behind that is managing revenue and making sure that you optimize it.

So it’s a win-win for both you and your client when you really have an understanding and a strategy to go along with it.

Wendy Doris: It, it is really important for the owners to, uh, to believe and trust that you have revenue management locked in and not just, uh, throwing numbers up and hoping that it works. I mean, imagine having somebody else manage for you,

Sarah Karakaian: right?

Right, right. And, and you’re like, well, what’s your strategy? And they’re like, oh, I have price labs. And you know, and if you’re a savvy investor, you know, you might ask. What is, what is your strategy for the year? We, we actually had an owner that asked, like you said, you know, uh, hey, we noticed that this January was different than last January.

We’re not talking in a good way and you better believe we had to have an explanation for why [00:43:00] that is. Right. And so we can dig in, listen, the data’s out there. Even for those of you who say, and I just started, I don’t have historicals. I don’t know what last year looked like, but there are, so now it’s not like it was in 2015 or earlier.

There are so many short-term rentals out there, vacation rentals out there. The data. Out there to help you have a base to go off of, to create your own strategy. And so that’s another reason why this software is so great ’cause you can go into other people’s historicals and help you shape the story for your, for your property.

Anything that’s on the horizon for you. And it comes to strategy like you love you. I like, I know that you like looking at what’s booked. In terms of reservations that are coming up so you can kind of benchmark yourself, how are you doing? Is there anything else you’re looking to improve on this year or, or get better at?

Consistency in Revenue Management

Wendy Doris: You know, I’m, um, I really just want consistency, so to continue to stay looking at it weekly, at the very least. Um, and. [00:44:00] Continuing to monitor. ’cause I think that sometimes we can get into this, like I’m in revenue management mo mode, or I’m on listing mode. And then you do all the things and set it up, and then you’re like, okay, onto the next thing.

But it’s a consistency that you have to keep, um, and, and monitoring because every week, every day the calendar opens another day or another week. So, um, we gotta be looking out that far and paying attention. Um. And not letting the dog walk itself.

Sarah Karakaian: Dog walk itself. I love that.

Annette Grant: The consistency, I think is the.

A good place to kind of wrap up the episode because all of us that are host and have a million things to do, um, just living life, that is probably the hardest pill to swallow is the consistency one, and knowing that nothing with your property is set it and forget it. But, um, if, you know, you have to be consistent with it and just take it step by step, it [00:45:00] becomes a little bit more consumable For sure.

Bootcamp Invitation and Conclusion

Annette Grant: That there are resources out there to help you stay consistent.

Sarah Karakaian: Wendy, will you be joining us for the bootcamp? I’m kind of putting you on the spot right now. Of course. I love that. So if you wanna hang out with Wendy, she loves to come into the popup Facebook group. She’ll be on, on the calls. Um, so you can you get to network with hosts like Wendy, Wendy, share with our listeners where they can find out more about you.

Maybe they’re listening. They’re looking for a co-host or a place to stay, or they just wanna look at your incredible website ’cause it’s so beautiful. Where should they reach out to you?

Wendy Doris: You can go to my website at www dot most doho, or you can follow us on instagram@most.host. And if you wanna come to Arizona and stay one of our properties.

Um. We would love to host you.

Annette Grant: Yes. I love that you’ve had the pleasure of seeing Wendy and it’s so good. Please follow Wendy. Go to her website, [00:46:00] incredible inspiration, and yes, book a Stay if you’re headed to AZ

Sarah Karakaian: and book direct. Yes, book direct. Love that, and host. We’ll follow Wendy on Instagram ’cause she is a hoot.

She is sassy and I am here for it. If you want to join us in the bootcamp. Thanks for visiting.com/bootcamp. We also have links in the show notes. You’ll be, we’ll be talking about it on our Instagram, on all of our, you know, podcasts, um, leading up to it because it’s just really important and we really want you to take action in, invest in yourself.

It is a small investment and you get to. Wendy does de take out some time in your calendar, dedicate to improving your pricing skills, and you can do it alongside a lot of fun hosts. With that, I am Sarah Karakaian.

Annette Grant: I’m Annette Grant, and together we are Thanks for Visiting. Talk to you next time. [00:47:00]