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[00:00:05] Annette: Hello. Welcome back for another great episode. My name is Sarah Karakaian.

[00:00:09] Annette: I am Annette Grant. And together we are–

[00:00:11] Both Annette & Sarah: Thanks for Visiting.

[00:00:12] Sarah: Let’s start this episode like we do every week, doing our STR Share Sunday. It is a hashtag that you can use on Instagram. If you use our hashtag, we will find you. We’ll find your property. We’ll share it here on the podcast. We’ll share it to our entire email list. We’ll also share it on Instagram on Sunday. Not sure if I said that, hence the hashtag, but today’s episode, is part three in our series called We Bought Land because Annette and I bought land, and we’re going to do a glamping site. And so we’re going to share our Instagram account for the glamping site.

[00:00:41] Annette: So today we are sharing @richhollowretreat. Again, that’s @richhollowretreat.

[00:00:48] Sarah: How do you think we’re doing, Annette? I think we could do better.

[00:00:51] Annette: We could definitely do better, but I want to share something, two things, about this account, something that they’ve done well. Seriously, I know this gets difficult sometimes, but you have to be your own marketing person, your own chief marketing officer.

[00:01:09] And I can share that today we were talking about this episode. I’m like, we’ve got to share our Instagram handle. We have got to get our listeners following us. And then part two is we were at actually a grand opening of our partners on the land. They just opened a new property, and we went to their house warming/grand opening of their new short-term rental.

[00:01:30] And as we were on their front porch, hanging out, celebrating, another short-term rental family walked by, and we will give them a shout out. They are @The Cliffs. Is it just @The Cliffs or @The Cliffs Hocking Hills?

[00:01:44] Sarah: Yeah.

[00:01:45] Annette: And they have a tremendous following. And you guys, I was bold and was like, hey, why could you guys–

[00:01:53] Sarah: When Annette says tremendous following, first of all, they are such rockstars because when I met them–

[00:01:57] Annette: Oh wow. They have that many followers? I didn’t know. Oh my God.

[00:02:01] Sarah: I met Christine and Kimball, I was managing their downtown Columbus short-term rentals. And then–

[00:02:07] Annette: Wow. I was bold. I did not know.

[00:02:08] Sarah: Yeah, they have 541,000 followers because they have the most beautiful property in Hocking Hills, Ohio.

[00:02:16] Annette: That is wild. And so I shamelessly asked if they would tag us in a picture. I said, let’s take a pict?

[00:02:24] Sarah: A pict? Is that what kids are saying?

[00:02:27] Annette: Yeah, all the kids. I would love if you guys would tag us, and guess what? They did, and we are so thankful for them, so we’ll give them a shout out here.

[00:02:36] Sarah: Thank you for those 200 followers that we have.

[00:02:38] Annette: Yeah. But it matters. So you’ve got to be your voice for your property. This is about give and take. Sarah helped when they launched that property. For years she was the property manager and really helped them catapult their success there. And then also, they came to our conference, TFV Con. They loved it.

[00:03:02] And so we’ve given them and they have given to us. And so that is what we love about the short-term rental world. You guys, give us a follow. We’re going to do some fun stuff. We’ll do some giveaways here, but if you can give us a follow @Rich Hollow Retreat we would appreciate it.

[00:03:18] Sarah: Yeah, we wanted to give you an update. So if you haven’t listened to episode one and two, you should. Why? Because episode one, we actually have our business partner, a fellow investor on the project. And so if you have ever wondered what a partnership can look like, obviously there are probably 1 million ways to partner on a property.

[00:03:40] But this is how we did it. So listen to that episode. It is Episode 349, and you could see how we’ve structured this partnership. And then we did part two, Episode 361. This is where we shared, okay, what are we doing first? So we shared there’s a little cabin on these 135 acres, and we have decided to renovate that cabin before bringing any new builds or prefab structure to the property.

[00:04:08] And so we talked about how we designed it. We all have full-time jobs. How are we getting this done? What are our positions as the investors as a partnership? So that’s a really cool episode. Just like, okay, what’s first? Because so many of you guys will DM us or email us, or we’ll talk to you at events.

[00:04:24] And some of you who haven’t gotten started yet, you’re just like, I just don’t know where to start. There is so much to do. What is the first step? So again, there’s probably a million ways to do that, but that episode, Episode 361, shares what we did first.

[00:04:36] Annette: Yeah, so 349, 361, listen today, and we’re going to keep this going. And guess what? We’re acting like we’re taking you along for the ride, not just acting, but we’ve been on this ride for a while. We were trying to come up with dates yesterday, but we’ve probably been at this for almost two years now. So for those of you that are out there trudging along, feels like you are moving at a snail’s pace, we feel you.

[00:04:59] Sarah: Or if you’re out there consuming content and it feels like everyone else is moving so fast, and they’re just getting these deals and properties just popping up, and you should learn from these people who have it just so easy. Annette and I forever and always want to keep it real with you. And there are times when things feel easy breezy, but most of the time it’s hard. And this is a long-haul project.

[00:05:22] Annette: Yeah. And we can share. The money is going out every day, every month. The first is rolling around. And our note, it’s over 8,000 a month. So that money is going bye-bye each month. And plus, we have a decent down payment. But we were there yesterday. We started demo, and I’m so naive.

[00:05:44] I’m like, Sarah, are we going to be swinging hammers? We show up 20 minutes late because we stopped at Starbucks. I’m not going to lie. I’m like, well, if I’m going to swing hammer, I need Starbucks. We got there 20 minutes late. This cabin is 700 square feet. The cabinets were ripped out. The carpet was gone. The bathrooms were already being disassembled. The demo crew was getting after it. So I didn’t get to swing it.

[00:06:10] Sarah: We gave you a drill.

[00:06:13] Annette: They gave me a drill, so I could–

[00:06:14] Sarah: Get the base cabinet out.

[00:06:15] Annette: And drill one hole. But it was a great day. What I’m loving right now is I actually did wake up super excited to go.

[00:06:26] Sarah: It was fun.

[00:06:27] Annette: It was really, really fun. Again, we were talking about that slog where you just feel like you’re grinding, grinding, grinding. But yesterday was one of those days that I really was excited like, oh my gosh, this is so cool. We know it’s going to be a roller coaster, but being there yesterday– and Sarah and her husband have a ton of experience with flips. I don’t. I’ve never done a renovation project. I’ve built a home, but I’ve never personally done a renovation project at all. And just having Mike Navarro on our team–

[00:07:00] Sarah: He’s our partner.

[00:07:01] Annette: He is our partner, and Sarah was laughing at me because they had our plans on a truck bed, and I just thought it was the coolest thing. I’m like, oh, that’s so cool. Where do we even get those plans? And Sarah’s like, Annette, my husband, that’s what he’s doing.

[00:07:15] But being able to see people in action, but there is stuff with this land that I butted heads with Mike and everybody on our team because I thought this was too high priced, and I actually bailed out of the project before because I can share, I was being kept up at night, very nervous.

[00:07:36] It was a large investment for me, and I didn’t feel comfortable with the amount of land. I didn’t feel comfortable with the amount and told the team that I couldn’t be a part of it. And luckily, the deal came back around with a less amount of land and a less amount of purchase price.

[00:07:54] And so just my comfortability then changed with that. But one of those butting heads with Mike, because there’s so much land available, I’m like, why can’t we just go buy this land somewhere else? This is cheaper. Well, it didn’t have any utilities. It didn’t have a road.

[00:08:12] And yesterday, just going through all those things, the road’s already there, the electricity is already there. The septic’s already there. Those are invaluable intangibles that, those things being there, if you are out there buying land, wow. Between Mike Navarro and then Mike Hicks, who’s one of our mentors too, on just raw land. The whole septic issue and those utilities, I can’t even imagine how much money we would have had to invest for those things, and losing time. So those are huge, and we can already see. Yesterday we were calling the electric company because we’re going to get, what is it, Sarah, the new–

[00:08:47] Sarah: We need to run power. So there’s a lot of land, listeners. So we have a cabin that already exists. This is where the owner lived when he lived on this land. It was not before a glamping site. We’re going to renovate this cabin, get some quick cash flow, but then, of course, we’re going to develop this land, and we’re going to bring in other units.

[00:09:05] And so these other units are probably going to be about, I am terrible at this, maybe 100 yards away from the cabin maybe. So we have to run power to the other units that are not involved in the cabins, and we’re going to run it underground. And so Mike was explaining to Annette we have to have the electric company set us up for that so that he can then run it to the two new cabins.

[00:09:28] Annette: And this is stuff that he just knew. He just knows. I wouldn’t have known it, and I would have to hire a GC.

[00:09:36] Sarah: And what did he tell you how much a GC will cost you these days?

[00:09:38] Annette: He was letting us know that a GC would probably be, I think, 50% of the project, the full price. And so that math ain’t mathing for me. They earn every dollar, and the extra layer is that this property is out there. 

[00:09:55] So for us to be able to get talent, to be able to get everyone out to the job site would then also layer on another added expense. So luckily, we don’t have those added expenses, and that’s where Sarah and I want to share that with you. Those are things we are saving hundreds and hundreds of thousands of dollars between having a general contractor, having Sarah’s husband who has an architecture firm on our team.

[00:10:24] So we want to share that with everybody that we were capable to purchase more land at a higher price point because we’re saving on all of those things. And so I think what my message there is, if you’re watching YouTube or if you’re watching HDTV, a lot of times there’s intangibles there that people aren’t sharing with you.

[00:10:47] There are some shortcuts sometimes. There are ways to get ahead. There are some advantages, and having Mike and Nick in our team are a huge advantage. Just like when it’s coming to run the short-term rental, we have all of us, including Mike’s wife on the team. So just want to share that, but we need to make some money.

[00:11:08] Sarah: We need to make some money. We need to make it fast, and we need to make money before the season is up. So right now when we’re recording this, it’s June.

[00:11:17] Annette: Middle of June.

[00:11:18] Sarah: Yes. And people in Ohio like to go out and cabin and hike and all those sorts of things in the summer and fall.

[00:11:25] Annette: In the summer. Yeah.

[00:11:26] Sarah: So if we want some cash flow to come in here, we got at least catch that fall season

[00:11:31] Annette: Right. So the cabin demo started yesterday. We’re putting about six weeks on that renovation, cross our fingers. I’m sure that’s very aggressive.

[00:11:40] Sarah: No, it’s 700 square feet. I really think it’s quite doable. We already have it designed. We have literally every single material that we’re going to bring into the interior. If you listen to last episode, I actually outsourced that because here’s another kicker about this whole partnership, is we all have full-time jobs.

[00:11:55] Now, all of our full-time jobs are short-term rental adjacent. Well, Nick has an architecture firm, and he does A frames and cabins for a lot of people in the Hocking Hills area. But still, he’s got that full-time. He’s got a team. He’s got other work to do.

[00:12:12] Mike and Ingrid, they own all of their short-term rentals. I think they got 14 or 15 downtown Columbus, and they operate their own property management company for their own properties. And then, of course, Annette and I, Thanks for Visiting is our full-time job, plus I’m managing our properties. So we have other things going on.

[00:12:30] Annette: Right. So we’re not dedicating all of our time to it. And we understand that, and that was something from the start. We’re doing the math where we’re excited to get the cabin up and running. Sarah and I will do an episode on some forecasting– note for myself right now, what we think the cabin is going to make, but we’re like, we’ve been looking at opportunities. 

[00:12:56] There is so much land. We are overwhelmed, to be quite honest, of all of the things that we want to do, all the things that we want to put on the land. And we don’t want it to be hodge podgey or not thematic or just make sense because if you are on our calls that we have together, our team calls, we have new ideas every week.

[00:13:20] Sarah: We’re all entrepreneurs.

[00:13:21] Annette: Yeah. It’s a little overwhelming, to be honest, the amount of land, the amount of possibilities, and then the lack of bank account. So we can go down these fast tracks of what we want to do, but then you always get blocked by the budget. However, we do have some creative financing.

[00:13:45] And we have an opportunity which we have a deposit on, and we are going to put two small units relatively close to the cabins because, again, like we said earlier, infrastructure is readily available, and we could get them delivered and up and running, hopefully sooner than later. But we’ve looked at a couple of different prefab builds.

[00:14:10] Sarah: Just in case you’re not sure what that means, prefabrication, it’s built offsite, and it’s pretty much delivered either already built in some cases for people or there’s a kit and you assemble it yourself, but you could be up in a day, two days, three days, literally ready to go. Some of them are–

[00:14:27] Annette: You have to hook them up to your electric or septic. So yeah, it runs the gamut, but we’ve been looking at a ton of them. We had an opportunity of something that’s ready to go, and we were super excited about it, and we were like, we’ll be the first ones in Ohio. Let’s do it, blah, blah, blah. And then the vendor, we were like, can you confirm we’re going to be the first people to have these units here?

[00:14:51] Sarah: We were misguided, and she was like, yeah.

[00:14:53] Annette: Absolutely. And we were so excited. We’re like full steam ahead. But then she was honest and to get back to us and said, womp, womp. No, you will not be the first people. We just delivered two units a day ago. And so the wind was taken out of our sales a little bit.

[00:15:11] Sarah: I was cranky.

[00:15:12] Annette: Yeah. Sarah was not happy, but here’s the deal. If you have not seen them yet, we are buying some of the mirrored homes, the mirrored glamping units. We actually saw them at the Glamping Show in Colorado in 2023. And despite there being a few other units that are going to be very close to us, there are still very few of them in the US. 

[00:15:35] They’re actually based in Estonia. They have a lot of these units overseas, but still, I think less than 100 here in the US. And the reason that we had to take that like, we want to be the first is we can get them quickly. They are still amazing units. They are an experience. They are something that speed to market and what the average daily rate is very enticing to us with the possibility also that the way that we arrange them, situate them, we could also potentially move them in the future to a larger part of our development. So there’s options.

[00:16:21] Sarah: There are options. So the mirror houses are cool. When you’re inside as a guest, you can see out. There’s one wall behind you that is not mirrored–

[00:16:31] Annette: With the door, where the actual entry door is.

[00:16:34] Sarah: Right. So that’ll face, let’s say, the road. But when you’re in there as a guest, you can see out, but no one can see in. They are not just down the road from us. Did someone else apparently buy a couple of these for their glamping site? But I believe our friends over at, well–

[00:16:50] Annette: Treehouse Farm.

 [00:16:51] Sarah: Treehouse Farm, yes. We had them on the show. They are lovely human beings. I think they were truly the first people in the US to have them. And now there’s a couple in Vermont. There’s a couple elsewhere. But like Annette said, they’re such a cool experience.

[00:17:02] Here’s what we did learn too from our research. We also talked about this in last episode. It’s 2024. It is a little bit harder to get guests to come. There’s market saturation. And in this area, Hocking Hills, there are a lot of really cool properties and so we knew we needed an experience.

[00:17:18] And so like Annette said, we could get them soon. They’re somewhat affordable when you look at how much we can charge per night. And I know that there is enough market demand for travel around here because we are in between– there’s Columbus, Dayton, Cincinnati.

[00:17:32] These are things that we’re looking at for people to come enjoy. But here’s what I wanted to say, I forgot for a second there, is while we want our property to be thematic in some way, shape, or form, our stays, there’s going to be options what structure you can stay on when you visit us.

[00:17:50] Because our hope is, what we’re trying to design is you want to come back and stay in that really cool spot. You come for the mirror house, and then you’re walking around a property, taking a hike, and you see something really cool, and you’re like, oh, we got to come back and stay in that unit. It’s like collect all four. You know what I mean?

[00:18:07] Annette: Also, what we like about these particular units is they are small. So if you are a single traveler, it works for you. If you’re a couple, it works for you. So we’re also looking about market demand, is if we were to build one giant cabin, you really limit the amount of stays that you can draw in. 

[00:18:27] Obviously, you’d have a much higher average daily rate, but then you also need to have 15 to 20 people planning their trip around it. So if we have the smaller units, easier for us to get up and running, and then also demand most travelers there.

[00:18:43] Sarah: We have to juggle, listeners– this was hard for me, especially doing what Annette and I do on the podcast and being thought leaders in the space or at least that’s the intention, is to know that we have to bring cash flow to this property. And then you can layer on the creativeness as you go, and that’s hard.

[00:19:03] Annette: Oh, yeah. There were talks in the very beginning, like, demoing the cabin. We’re like, the cabin’s perfect. When I say demo, completely demolishing it. It’s like, no, the cabin works. It’s already built. Like yesterday, when Sarah and I were driving away from the property, I was like, oh my gosh, this is day one.

[00:19:24] But I can’t imagine if we were truly day one, no infrastructure, no roads, no electricity, no plumbing. We would literally be T minus a year out. I don’t even know what that day one would be. Our day one is just demoing something that’s already there, which feels–

[00:19:43] Sarah: And when we say demo, like Annette said, carpet cabinets. We’re going to move a couple walls.

[00:19:50] Annette: Is that even considered demo?

[00:19:51] Sarah: Yeah. You didn’t see it. We’re going to remove some walls. 

[00:19:53] Annette: Minor demo.

[00:19:54] Sarah: Yeah. But I guess what I’m saying is we’re not gutting the entire cabin. It’s really from the walls in, so it’s still challenging. There’s still things that can pop up, but it’s quite ideal in terms of getting it turned around, having a very sensible ADR and getting some cash flow to our property.

[00:20:12] Annette: How’s our poll going? We have a rollout bed underneath the kitchen. I want to keep it. 

[00:20:21] Sarah: Explain to the listeners. They may not have seen our Instagram post.

[00:20:23] Annette: The kitchen in the cabin is slightly elevated. So you have to go up about four stairs. So the kitchen and the bedroom are elevated. Not sure why. Maybe that was the elevation of the property. I’m not actually sure why.

[00:20:38] Sarah: We’ll find out once we remove the floors.

[00:20:39] Annette: Well, the kitchen is tiny. Again, we’re talking about 700 square feet here. There is a bed that actually is on a frame but on wheels that rolls underneath the kitchen. So there’s no headboard. It’s probably hard to envision, but stay with me. It is literally a rollaway bed. It rolls away under the kitchen into the wall. And I think it’s really cool. And we were going to get rid of it, but yesterday after being there all day, it’s like, wow, this is like an experience. How cool. There’s a bed under the kitchen. For me, I’m close to the snacks. Let’s go. 

[00:21:16] Sarah: Versus a sleeper sofa.

[00:21:18] Annette: Versus a sleeper sofa. I think it’d be a cool experience for kids. I don’t know about you, but the bars in the sleeper sofa and things like that, honestly, I end up just sleeping on the sofa most of the time instead of pulling it out. But I’m thinking we can do it really nice, close it off, but it can still be a rollaway bed. That’s amazing. So we’ll keep you in the loop on if we keep the rollaway bed.

[00:21:39] Sarah: We did a poll on Instagram, and people were voting to keep it.

[00:21:43] Annette: How many people though? What was the percentage?

[00:21:46] Sarah: Last time I looked, keep was 70%.

[00:21:48] Annette: Oh, then that wins. It wins. We’re keeping the rollaway.

[00:21:54] Sarah: But anyway, that’s what’s going on with the cabin. That’s what’s going on with the mirror houses. We’re getting two of them. They’ll arrive as kits, and we have to assemble the walls, but then we actually bought them without the interiors. You can buy them with the interiors. We like this because we can do our own thing to the inside. 

[00:22:17] Annette: Personalize those.

[00:22:18] Sarah: Yeah. And we enjoy that part. So we’re going to do that ourselves. But Annette, do you want to share as much as you can about how we’re going to finance these mirror homes?

[00:22:25] Annette: Yeah. This has been fun. This is a new territory for me, is trying to figure out how we’re going to pay for them because the thing with prefab homes versus a construction loan is most prefab homes, you have to pay a hundred percent before they deliver them. Because once they deliver them to you, they’re on your land. They’re yours.

[00:22:47] Sarah: And a lot of times banks won’t finance them because there’s no foundation.

[00:22:51] Annette: So have not even talked to banks about any of these because we’re probably maxed out, to be honest. We had to jump through some hoops just to get the actual land deal done. But we have been networking and networking and networking, and we are coming up with some creative financing for the mirror units. I can share.

[00:23:17] I almost didn’t want to share it on this episode because it’s not signed yet. So I’m like, Sarah, I don’t know if I want to talk about it because we haven’t signed up. But we’re going to talk about it, and we’ll share once everything is signed. But we are doing some creative financing on the mirror homes, and we’ll share all the details because we’re still working those details out.

[00:23:34] There is an application process with this person that wants to do the creative financing for us. So we’re in the process of doing that application right now. And we’ll share with everyone also that I’m waiting on K-1 from some other real estate investment. So I have an extension for my taxes right now. I’m not sure about my other partners, but a lot of times they want to see your most recent tax returns, things of that nature. 

[00:23:57] So we’ve got to, again, jump through some hoops and let them know, hey, here’s where we stand, but this is where we’re at today, and explain to them waiting on some of those K-1s that it’s out of my control. And I can share, I’ve been getting K-1s for almost, I don’t know, 15 years now. 

[00:24:14] And so I’ve had to file an extension on my taxes. So for those of you out there that feel bad, I used to feel bad about filing an extension, and I’ve had to now for 15-plus years. So it’s not anything about me. It’s just they’re not getting those. So I just want to give everybody out there, if you have to file extension, don’t feel bad.

[00:24:29] Sarah: Oh, let’s get around with that. You just got to file the extension though. That’s the most part.

[00:24:32] Annette: Oh yeah. And if you will, if you know that you owe, you need to pay it ahead of time too. You’ll get penalized for that.

[00:24:41] Sarah: Okay. So can we share a little bit more details about the financing?

[00:24:44] Annette: Yeah. So the creative financing that we’re going to do, we’ve already put a small deposit down on the mirror places because we needed to hold them. So we did that out of our bank account, just cash. But the financing, we would need to put 10% down, and they’ll honor whatever percentage we’ve given to the mirror homes.

[00:25:04] And then after that, I think we’re going to do a three-year loan with an option to purchase at the end, so almost like a lease to own, and it’s looking pretty good. So we need to put 10% deposit down. The interest rate will be around 10%. We will have monthly payments that’ll kick in ASAP, and then we’ll have that lease purchase to own at the end of 36 months.

[00:25:32] And we feel good about these numbers. We thought about other private money, not this type of creative financing. And the other part with this partner is we can close this really quickly and get the full amount of funds to the mere home peeps before too long because speed is also what matters here. And this is someone that we’re hoping to have a long-term relationship with. So also laying a foundation there.

[00:25:59] Sarah: And we’re going to raise private funds for the decking around the units and the hot tub that’s going to go to the units, and move the roads slightly and then, of course, create roads to the units. So we’re going to have to tap into other relationships to fully build out the actual mirror home experience before we can welcome a guest there.

[00:26:23] Annette: For sure, yeah. And we had a lot of chatter about it of, even though we have 133 acres, we can’t just put one in one spot and 10 acres away have another one. It just doesn’t work like that. So they’re actually going to be fairly close together, but with some thoughtfulness, with some–

[00:26:48] Sarah: Positioning and landscaping.

[00:26:50] Annette: Positioning and landscaping. They will feel private. But it’s just funny. As we’re getting into this project, even now when I drive through the country, I never thought about why are people’s homes right on the front of the road?

[00:27:01] It’s like, it’s less expensive to put the plumbing and electricity there, even though they have hundreds of acres. You’re not going to put them out in your pastures. It’s all making a lot of sense to me now because it don’t make dollars; it don’t make sense. But the creative financing I can share, is very uncomfortable for me. I’m having lots of conversations that I haven’t had before. I’ve been on the phone more in the past.

[00:27:25] Sarah: You’ve been heading up–

[00:27:26] Annette: 60 days.

[00:27:27] Sarah: You’ve been heading up getting the deal done for the mirror houses for sure.

[00:27:30] Annette: Yeah, so I’ve been picking up the good old telephone, and just going back and forth. I’ve been doing three-way calls, really utilizing that technology. But that’s what’s winning right now, is just picking up the phone, asking the questions, and connecting the people that need to be connected.

[00:27:46] And if I don’t know something, just telling them that I don’t know something. If I can share with them why I think it’s going to be a good idea, sharing that. So I’ve got all the parties that are working with us excited. And I can share that Sarah and I having an audience and us putting ourselves out there with our podcasts, with our social media. It makes it easy when I’m talking with anyone that we’re looking to work with.

[00:28:12] They can come and see our body of work very quickly online, whether it be a website, social media. So that’s where I want to encourage everybody, whatever footprint you feel comfortable with, when you are going to partner with folks, whether it be a business partnership, a lending partnership, that social proof that’s out there, you putting yourselves out there will be helpful in those endeavors. But I’m going back to the old-school telephone. I haven’t faxed anything, but I’ll let you know. Someone asked my sister to fax something recently.

[00:28:41] Sarah: I think it was a bank.

[00:28:42] Annette: We own a property with my sister too. My sister’s like, can you fax it? We were like, they actually– and it was a big bank where they asked– makes us not want to work with them that they asked to fax.

[00:28:51] Sarah: Okay, so what’s next on the land too to keep you guys involved is how we’re going to get the mirror houses to the area of our land. Because the road getting up to the property is on a hill. It’s twisty, turny, and these things are not quite like a wide load, but it’s still going to be a challenge to get them there.

[00:29:13] So we’re not quite sure. So my husband’s got to talk to the manufacturer about all those things, make sure we can get them there. So that’s one concern that we have. And then, of course, like I said, the decking, the hot tub, the roads going, and that’s going to be a financial commitment.

[00:29:29] And we have to run these numbers to see like, okay, what’s our cash on cash for us as the investors on the property? And we can’t wait to market this. This right now is considered marketing. Yes, we also want to share with you guys what we’re going through, but I’ve been talking to Annette like, okay, we need help with branding, and let’s get our website started.

[00:29:47] Okay. What OTAs are we going to use? Let’s get ready to go. What’s our email list going to look like? How are we going to email these people? Because Mike and Ingrid have their own business. I have my own property management business, but this is going to be a separate entity altogether. So we’re starting from square one when it comes to that. And so we’re thinking about it’s like, gosh, I haven’t done this in years.

[00:30:07] Annette: Right. I actually had to set up our QuickBooks account, which if you need help setting up your QuickBooks, reach out to us because we’re trying to think of some workshops to do around it, and I was like, oh my gosh, it’s been so long since I went in and opened a new QuickBooks account. I was actually emailing our account because she was asking for some details before this, but taking it back to that, we want to take you step by step through this.

[00:30:28] We are recording some YouTube videos also, so we’re going to be documenting video, and we can share that with you. Sarah just said something about cash-on-cash return. I have not thought about that, not zero, not zilch. Because this is long term.

[00:30:50] The investment that I have made here, I have thought long and hard about I’m not even going to stress about that. This is a long, long-term play. And I also want everybody to feel confident. If this is a lifestyle asset or a long-term investment for you, don’t be cash on cash shamed.

[00:31:11] Sarah: No.

[00:31:12] Annette: That’s how we’re rolling on this property, and I know bookings are down for people, and it’s a struggle for some. And I just want people to go back to their why of why they purchased their property, why they got involved in short-term rentals and just, continue to think about that.

[00:31:30] Sarah: No, my intention was definitely not to shame anyone. So Annette pointed this out the other day. If someone asked you how much your property was–

[00:31:42] Annette: How much did you buy your property for?

[00:31:45] Sarah: And you’re like, oh, I bought it for 250,000. It’s like, oh, that’s what it gets sold for. That’s what you closed at. Cool. But if you’ve financed it, what is that 6%, 7%? Or if you’re lucky, 2, 3% that you add on to that after the 30-year note.

[00:32:00] Annette: Total cost of the loan. Right.

[00:32:02] Sarah: I joked. I was like, well, that’s future Sarah’s problem. It’s not current Sarah. But while I joke about that, I do want to make sure that I understand, okay, so if we’re putting in this money, what does the deal look like in terms of us getting– because I actually think we’re going to be pretty pleased as I’m looking at these rough numbers in terms of average daily rates because they are changing and what we’re bringing the property.

[00:32:23] I think we’re going to be pretty pleased with how soon we can bring back us owners a profit on the land. And I think we don’t need to obsess over it or say it’s no deal. I think that’s the sickness that I’m trying to–

[00:32:38] Annette: Remedy?

[00:32:39] Sarah: Or kibosh with some of these gurus saying like, I won’t even start a project if I’m cash flowing right away. It’s like, cool, then I guess you’re not investing in anything like anytime soon.

[00:32:48] Annette: Mm-hmm.

[00:32:49] Sarah: And I know someone could get on their soapbox and start preaching back. And I’m not saying to also have a bad buy. I also think it’s irresponsible to invest in something and have no idea when you’re going to get that money back. This is a huge project.

[00:33:05] This is the development that we don’t have a bunch of private money yet sitting on the sidelines waiting to be deployed here. So we’re being methodical. We’re being thoughtful. It’s lifestyle. This is a legacy project for us, but at the same time, it’s good to understand your rough numbers and understand your projections.

[00:33:22] Do that work and understand, okay, I’m not going to get paid back for three years. And you’ll be okay with that. I’m not going to get paid back for five years and be okay with that.

[00:33:29] Annette: Apps.

[00:33:29] Sarah: Annette, when do you think we’re going to have these mirror houses delivered?

[00:33:35] Annette: I got a bunch of documents to sign. I’m sure they’re texting me right now. As soon as we can actually wire the payments, I think they’ll release them for shipment. So whatever that timeline looks like. So I think this is something that we’re in charge of the timeline right now of at least delivery.

[00:33:57] Sarah: And then I’ll you guys, my other fear is like, okay, these mirror houses aren’t that far from our cabin. So as we get the cabin ready, it’s all perfect. Now we’re going to have these mirror houses delivered, and we’re going to be building decks around them and hammering while these other guests are not too far away at the cabin trying to enjoy their stay. These are the things that we’re going to have to navigate.

[00:34:16] Annette: For sure.

[00:34:17] Sarah: And we’ll keep you posted. With that, I’m Sarah Karakaian.

[00:34:20] Annette: I am Annette Grant. And together we are– 

[00:34:22] Both Annette & Sarah: Thanks for Visiting.

[00:34:24] Sarah: Talk to you next time.