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[00:00:05] Sarah: Welcome back for another great week. My name is Sarah Karakaian.

[00:00:08] Annette: I am Annette Grant. And together we’re–

[00:00:10] Both Annette & Sarah: Thanks for Visiting.

[00:00:11] Sarah: Let’s kick off this episode like we do every week, and that’s sharing one of you, our listeners, who’s using our hashtag on the gram, #STRShareSunday. If you use the hashtag, we will find you. We will look at your profile. We will say, oh, that’s so cute. And then we’ll share you here in the podcast, to our entire email list, to Instagram on Sunday. Get it? So use the hashtag. Annette, who are we sharing this week?

[00:00:34] Annette: This week we are sharing @bluebirddaycottagemarin. Ooh, that was a lot. Again, @bluebirddaycottagemarin. And, so cute. One thing, I don’t how they’re doing this. I want them to teach me their ways. There is some amazing sunlight and shadows. It’s woven throughout their entire feed. When you go to their Instagram, you’ll see it, but it’s the most amazing natural light infused with shadows from their garden and from things outside and things inside.

[00:01:08] Somehow they’re capturing this. I’m sure it’s with a lovely iPhone, but it’s just giving me a mood, a vibe from the property, and I just have to give them kudos that, again, anyone, if you can document the process of you getting your short-term rental prepared, I think, a, your guests will love it and, b, it’s like a little personal album for you to look back on and see how far you’ve come.

[00:01:30] They did a really good job of documenting some of their, before and afters and their progress, and they just created this amazing space for their guests. And I want to say kudos to them too because they’re doing carousels and reels throughout their entire feed. And they also have a carousel, which I thought was a great idea, where they’re actually touring the home.

[00:01:54] So each carousel is actually a video, which I didn’t even know you could do this. So each slide is a different room, and I thought that was genius. So well done, Bluebird Day Cottage Marin. Thank you for using the hashtag and we cannot wait to share one of you next. And listeners, go give them some love, please.

[00:02:15] Sarah: All right. We have some announcements to make, everyone, out there in the world.

[00:02:20] Annette: I feel like you want to do announcements because one of our episodes we recorded today. The principal was going to get on the PA and make the announcements and you said you missed those from school.

[00:02:29] Sarah: Anyone else get so excited when you got chosen by your principal to come to the principal’s office, not for reasons because you were misbehaving, but because you got to do the morning announcements? If you feel me, let me know on Instagram.

[00:02:41] Annette: Yeah, you got real excited when he–

[00:02:42] Sarah: There is a certain brand of brown-noser, and that was me/is me, but hey, I’m going to let my freak flag fly. That’s always very hard to say. But no, we have some cool announcements to share, one of which is we’ve heard you all, and pricing your properties is a pain point.

[00:03:05] It is something that we never feel that we’ve really mastered, or everyone’s talking about dynamic pricing, but that looks like the software looks like it might be hard to learn. How do I figure out what my base price should be like, that base price? Everything else that pricing is built off of during your high season and your low season.

[00:03:28] So what we have done here at Thanks for Visiting is we have connected with PriceLabs. That’s the dynamic pricing software that we use in our hosting business. And we’re partnering up the entire month of May and doing content around pricing pretty much across all of Thanks for Visiting.

[00:03:48] Annette: Profit Pricing with PriceLabs in May. I just named it, Sarah. There you go.

[00:03:53] Sarah: That’s so good.

[00:03:54] Annette: Profit Pricing with PriceLabs in May.

[00:03:56] Sarah: So if you go to our website, we’re going to have a banner right there before you have to do anything else. If you don’t yet use dynamic pricing software, they’ll have a special offer for you to do that, to join them.

[00:04:10] If that’s not something that you’re ready to do, that’s okay too. We are going to have some podcast episodes around pricing. We’re going to be going live on Instagram and talking about pricing.

[00:04:19] Annette: And the reason we’re doing it for a full month– I have a new name now. It’s Moneymaking May with PriceLabs. So during moneymaking May, the reason we are going to stay focused on it, I’m actually personally in membership, and each month we do a focused month, so you can really go deep and make that your focus every single day. 

[00:04:35] And we know as hosts you are super busy, but let’s make moneymaking May a priority, and we want to just continue to dig into pricing. Because I can tell you this. Pricing is something that is ever changing, but the more you understand it, the more money you truly are going to make.

[00:04:51] It can compound over time. So this groundwork that you’re putting in is, that’s compound over time. It’s going to be awesome for you and your business.

[00:05:00] Sarah: Yes. And then of course, as always, if you’ve got questions about pricing, May’s the time to ask them. So slid into our DMs. You can email us. We have a Hosting Hotline. Go to hostinghotline.com. Ask your questions about pricing. Let’s talk about money in May.

[00:05:16] Annette: Money Making in May.

[00:05:18] Sarah: All right. Next up is today’s episode, which was so fun to record.

[00:05:24] Annette: It was a blast. Our guests are members of our Hosting Business Mastermind and have just really brought a lot of energy, a lot of transparency in how hard business can be and growing, and scaling, and learning on the go, and have just been a great member, showing up to all the calls, sharing their advice, but also just being open to any advice that we can give them to. And we just want to share their story. They are inspiring. They’re just a joy to hang out with.

[00:05:59] Sarah: To give you a little bit of insight before we hop in, everybody, they own a motel. They own a boutique hotel, and they own and manage other people’s vacation rentals.

[00:06:11] Annette: Last but not least, a wedding venue.

[00:06:14] Sarah: Oh yeah.

[00:06:14] Annette: If your head is spinning, so is ours. But let’s hear how they keep it all together.

[00:06:18] Sarah: Austin and Karlee, welcome to the show.

[00:06:22] Annette: Let’s dig in, right?

[00:06:24] Sarah: Yeah. Take us back to– is there a time pre hospitality, and then how does hospitality become a part of your story?

[00:06:33] Annette: Everyday life.

[00:06:34] Sarah:  Yes.

[00:06:35] Annette: Woven into every piece of your life now.

[00:06:39] Karlee: Let’s get started.

[00:06:40] Austin: Yeah, you start.

[00:06:41] Karlee: Well, I guess, I’ll start. I have been in hospitality for a very long time, just a different form of hospitality. I’ve been in the wedding business since I was pretty much 18. And so I’ve had a lot of experience with events, that sort of thing. And then we jumped into the motel business in 2019, and that’s where it started our hospitality lodging gig we got going on.

[00:07:10] Austin: Yeah, she actually studied hospitality in college, so she has a hospitality degree, worked at a hotel, but totally in events. And then I was in construction, so we had things that make for good hospitality and for owning your own motel, short-term rental type business, but are not direct.

[00:07:31] And so combining those two has worked out pretty well for us starting in 2019. And the motel came to be because of the wedding venue. We were living two hours from where we currently live in Durango, Colorado. And then we had a family place in Chama, New Mexico, up in the mountain. Karlee actually told me on our first date we went on that she wanted to turn that place into a wedding venue.

[00:07:53] And so the motel came to be out of trying to figure out how to move to Chama to open the wedding venue business. So when we got married there, the owners of this motel had been trying to sell their property for five years, five or seven years at this point. 

[00:08:11] Karlee: Seven years, I think. Yeah. 

[00:08:12] Austin: And if you walked in the door, you got offered the motel.

[00:08:16] Annette: I was, going to say, what does trying to sell the motel mean? Just asking anybody that walked through the doors, or was it on the market?

[00:08:22] Austin: Yeah.

[00:08:23] Karlee: It technically was on the market, but not with a local realtor, somewhat local. It was an hour and a half.

[00:08:28] Austin: I think it was off when we bought it.

[00:08:30] Karlee: Yeah. It was off the market when we bought it.

[00:08:34] Austin: For two years, every time we saw them, they would ask us, so when are you going to buy it? And we were always like, heck no. We want no part of that business. We want nothing to do with it. And then we happened to be in town one night and they asked us again, and after a late night of a couple bottles of wine with their parents, we were like–

[00:08:57] Karlee: Let’s do it. 

[00:08:68] Austin: Let’s see what much they want for it. They seem like they really want to sell it. And they threw us a deal, and it seemed dumb to say no, is what it took for us to get into the business. We were like, we can buy a house and a business all in one. So we were able to move into the living quarters, right behind the office, and we were like, we can do it all in one purchase. So it makes sense. So we just went for it.

[00:09:24] Annette: Did you have kids at this time?

[00:09:26] Karlee: No.

[00:09:26] Austin: No. I don’t know if we could have done it.

[00:09:30] Karlee: But we were only married for not even a year when we made this decision.

[00:09:35] Annette: Woo, you guys are a honeymoon phase and went for it. Were you both working full-time jobs elsewhere at this point in time?

[00:09:41] Karlee: Yes.

[00:09:41] Austin: Yes.

[00:09:43] Annette: Did you quit those jobs when you purchased this, or did you keep a hold of the jobs?

[00:09:48] Karlee: I quit my job and Austin stayed working for about five, six months.

[00:09:53] Austin: Yeah. I worked with her parents. We were building homes in Durango, semi-custom homes. So I worked for them until we moved into the motel January 1st, 2019. Karlee was starting the wedding venue business and the motel business all at the same time, and I’m building homes, and so I’m like, you just make all the decisions.

[00:10:14] Karlee did everything initially, and I lived in Durango during the week and then drove two hours back to Chama for the weekends until about mid-June. June?

[00:10:24] Karlee:  Around there. 

[00:10:25] Austin: And so I still worked till then.

[00:10:27] Sarah: I need to understand though. It was, no, I don’t want to buy the motel. No. We’re in the event business. No motel. No motel. I understand drinking a few glasses wine and making a decision. I’ve been there many times.

[00:10:37] Annette: It’s like ordering a pizza, not buying a motel.

[00:10:40] Sarah: Correct. Yeah. So like what were the dreams? What were you guys dreaming and scheming that night as to why that would be a yes for you at that moment? Were you just hankering for a project? I understand it was a good deal and that you could live on the property, but–

[00:10:56] Annette: That’s a big decision.

[00:10:57] Sarah: Yeah. What were your hopes and dreams, I guess, for this property right before you bought it? What did you dream it would become?

[00:11:04] Karlee: Basically, we needed something to get us to Chama full time. And so the wedding venue was definitely originally the main dream, the main reason to get us out there. And then we’re like, well, how can we make it work? Because we can’t just commute for two hours every time we need to show someone the property or anything like that.

[00:11:25] Austin: And Chama’s super remote, so there’s like no work. You can work for the county, or you can–

[00:11:32] Karlee: There’s a train.

[00:11:32] Austin:  A train, a seasonal tourist train, or seasonal jobs like working in the hunting industry. Other than that, there’s like no full-time.

[00:11:40] Annette: Really? What’s the population here?

[00:11:41] Karlee: 1,000.

[00:11:45] Sarah: So who is the guest?

[00:11:49] Karlee: All tourists.

[00:11:50] Austin: Yeah. The nearest town is about another hour away too. But we have the highest steam train in the United States or in North America, and it brings in 40, 50,000 people from all over the world every year.

[00:12:06] Annette: Okay.

[00:12:06] Austin: There’s actually a lot of motels in town. There’s probably 10, maybe 12.

[00:12:10] Annette: Oh really? You got a competition then.

[00:12:13] Austin: Sort of.

[00:12:14] Annette: Okay. Well, that night, did I hear you say your parents might have been drinking some of the wine?

[00:12:20] Karlee: My parents are partners in the motel with us.

[00:12:22] Annette: Okay. Yeah. Is there paper and pen?

[00:12:25] Sarah: Are you running numbers? 

[00:12:26] Annette: Because it sounds like you didn’t even know the price.

[00:12:30] Karlee: So we did at the time. We did at the time that we sat down for dinner and the wine came out. We had the price, and we had their P&L, which was one sheet. It was half a sheet. Everything pen and paper. Simple as simple can get.

[00:12:48] Austin: No website. 

[00:12:49] Karlee: It had a website, but you couldn’t book online. It was a one-page website, and so we’re like, well, how accurate is this P&L? 

[00:13:00] Austin: They were like, we do about 30 or 40% more of this in cash year.

[00:13:04] Karlee And we’re like, that doesn’t help us justify the purchase.

[00:13:08] Sarah: Oh my gosh.

[00:13:09] Annette: Right.

[00:13:11] Karlee: And so we had all this information, and we’re like, I don’t know, but the price seems okay. It seems like a good deal. And we woke up the next morning and went over there and said, let’s do it.

[00:13:24] Annette: Were they seller financing this or was it–

[00:13:27] Austin: Yes.

 [00:13:27] Annette: Okay. And can you give us a little bit of what the seller financing looked like and then how you did partner with your parents and or anybody else? Can you give us some of the numbers behind the deal?

[00:13:37] Karlee: I’ll let you do that. We’re technically not supposed to say numbers.

[00:13:41] Austin: We’ll do percentages. We’ll do percentages.

[00:13:44] Annette: Perfect. Thank you. Yeah, whatever’s not on ink, whatever. Break any law.

[00:13:49] Austin: So numbers wise, it started out they wanted about 50 to 60% down, and then her parents were going to provide the down, and then we were going to do the rest financed by them. It ended up being over 70. They wanted more than that down. They went to go buy a house, and they’re like, well, we need more down now.

[00:14:15] Annette: Okay.

[00:14:17] Austin: And so we ended up giving more down than initial. So it upped to another 10%, and then they financed the remaining. So it ended up being about 70, 30, 30% finance, 70% down. So that gives you an idea. It was a pretty good deal.

[00:14:31] Annette: Right. And what’s the deal with your parents? Are they going to stay partners forever, or did you have like a short amount of time that you’re like, we’re going to be partner with you and then pay them off? Are they life lifelong partners in it with you?

[00:14:44] Karlee: As of right now, lifelong.

[00:14:46] Austin: We’ve offered to try to work out a deal to purchase it from them, and they’re like, we’re fine. They’re basic. In the beginning they were pretty hands on. They helped a lot.

[00:14:54] Karlee: Yeah, they did a ton. 

[00:14:56] Austin: They’re a big part of the remodel. Her parents own a pretty big construction business, so they’re super helpful in providing labor and just knowledge. But now, we tell them, hey, we’re doing this. And they’re like, sounds good. You got it.

[00:15:11] Annette: So there’s a remodel. Was that when you were buying it, like, we have to remodel that place? Was that a part of the plan originally, or was it like, we might not have the cash to do that?

[00:15:23] Karlee: Both.

[00:15:25] Austin: Yes, both.

[00:15:27] Karlee: When we took the property, it was fairly maintained. But as we said, they were trying to sell for maybe seven years, and so a lot of maintenance had been forgotten about. And so we knew we would have to make changes at first or soon, but the first year we didn’t do anything. We sold as is, and it was still fairly successful. 

[00:15:53] Austin: We also were like, we have no idea what we’re doing. So if we remodel, what do we do? We were like, if we do it now, we’re just going to waste money on things that we’re going to realize down the road that like, oh, we didn’t need that. Or, why did we waste money there? So we waited a year, ran it as is, and it went pretty well for the most part.

[00:16:12] There were some things. We didn’t have AC the first year, which our highs are high. Our highs are in the high of 70s, low 80s in the summer, so it’s not too bad. But it’s also a motel. So like people park right in front of their door. So if somebody’s driving a diesel truck and they park in front of your door and you got your windows open at 6:00 AM, you’re smelling and listening to that.

[00:16:34] Annette: You went no AC the whole entire year. That’s one thing that you–

[00:16:37] Karlee: We did, and that was the absolute first thing. We’re like, we have to have AC by night. 

[00:16:41] Austin: I thought we waited two years. 

[00:16:45] Annette: You guys are going to have to–

[00:16:45] Sarah: Time flies when you’re having fun.

[00:16:48] Annette: So January 1, though, it sounds like they’ve been wanting to get out of a here for a while. Was there, we will train you for four weeks or two weeks. You can have us on call. Or is it like Austin and Karlee, January 1? Happy New Year. Happy Motel. Get after it. What’s the transition period? It doesn’t sound like you had a lot of systems.

[00:17:11] Austin: It going to get funnier, though, actually. So they’re like, here’s the keys to office because we can’t move into our house yet, so we’re going to live here until March.

[00:17:21] Annette: March?

[00:17:22] Karlee: So I lived in a hotel room for two months while they’re in the house. And so then I’d go into the office during office hours and–

[00:17:33] Austin: You can hear them in their house.

[00:17:34] Karlee: We can hear them talking, and they can hear us working upfront. It awkward, let’s just say.

[00:17:43] Annette: Were they helpful thought, like hey, this guest– I don’t know.

[00:17:45] Austin: No.

[00:17:48] Karlee: They were not helpful. 

[00:17:51] Austin: They didn’t move out of the shop– 

[00:17:53] Karlee:  But they were ready to be done. They really did try to give us as much help as they could offer.

[00:18:01] Austin: Because they loved it. They wanted it to be successful after–

[00:18:04] Karlee: They wanted it to continue to be ran well. And it just got to the point where we’re like, okay, we just need to maybe do our own thing. So for those first two months, I don’t know. We’d start doing something, and then I’d hear like a snide comment, and I’m like, well– 

[00:18:23] Austin: We didn’t want to offend them either because, like we said, they did take good care of it, and they had a good reputation. People in town might love the place. It had good reviews. 

[00:18:32] Karlee: A lot of repeat business. It was a great business for us to purchase. 

[00:18:37] Austin: We kept the name. 

[00:18:40] Karlee: We kept the name. Basically we made it until they were totally out to make any major changes because every little thing I did, I could tell it.

[00:18:51] Austin: It hurt. It just hurt.

[00:18:52] Sarah: I get that. And it’s not that it’s any other business because you technically purchased it, but let’s talk about the team. Did you inherit any of the team members?

[00:19:00] Karlee: Yes.

[00:19:00] Austin: We did.

[00:19:00] Karlee: We did.

[00:19:01] Sarah: Okay. Was that a good experience, or would you have liked to have started from the ground up?

[00:19:07] Austin: No, it was good.

[00:19:07] Karlee: It was great because we took their systems because we had never been in this business before. And so they had systems. Nothing was ever written. So I basically followed the housekeeping staff and took notes on it.

[00:19:20] Austin: The team was a housekeeping staff. That was it. There’s only 16 rooms, so everybody knows as well. It’s fairly small.

[00:19:27] Sarah: It was just 16 rooms. Yeah.

[00:19:30] Austin: It’s still a lot.

[00:19:32] Karlee: It was good having staff that was experienced. It definitely helped in the transition, gave us a little bit of insight, what worked really well, what didn’t work, what they would like to see changes on, what they thought might make the place better. It was really good, but it didn’t last super long because we did run things different. We wanted to up the level. We wanted to increase the quality. We wanted to increase everything, make it better. 

[00:20:06] Austin: They were just held more accountable. They kind of did their own thing. The previous owners were tired, didn’t want to do anything, so the housekeeping staff just really wasn’t held accountable. They did a pretty good job overall.

[00:20:17] Karlee: They did a great job, but it just wasn’t the right fit.

[00:20:21] Annette: What is a housekeeping team for 16 rooms at a motel? Is that four people? Is that eight people? And how they work it?

[00:20:26] Austin: It’s been everywhere.

[00:20:28] Karlee: All over the place. We had three that we started with, but it was one full-time person and two part-time, and that was great for the winter, but we found out really quick in summer in our busy season we needed way more. Currently, we have seven. It’s one full-time, and then a lot of part time. Come summer, we’ll probably turn one or two of the part-time employees into full-time.

[00:20:57] Austin: And we’ll add on with the vacation rentals that we now manage. We’re trying to supplement those housekeepers because we have a very, very good staff right now. And to try to bring them on full-time, we’re having them away from the motel to do housekeeping for some of the vacation rentals we manage to try to give them as many hours as we can.

[00:21:21] Sarah: That was my next question.

[00:21:22] Austin: So somebody else can’t steal them.

[00:21:24] Sarah: That was my next question. So you have the wedding, you have the event business, you have this motel, and then you just said you co-host for other people. Can you tell us what that means? what do you got going on over there?

[00:21:36] Austin: Okay. Like how we got into it or like what it–

[00:21:38] Sarah: Yeah, when, how? So you’ve got your own thing that you guys own on, but then you’re also managing for other people. When and why did you start that? It sounds like you’ve got your hands full. Plus, you got kiddos now.

[00:21:49] Karlee: Why don’t you talk about adding on the vacation rentals and then also adding the boutique hotel. Just give them a timeline. So then they can be caught up to where we are today. So we’re talking a lot about 2019.

[00:22:01] Annette: But 2019 was just the motel, 16 rooms. You guys had never hosted a guest. 

[00:22:07] Austin: In 2020.  

[00:22:08] Annette: In 2020. The wedding venue, was that up and running yet?

[00:22:12] Karlee: In 2019.

[00:22:13] Annette: In 2019. So you were hosting weddings at that point in time too?

[00:22:17] Austin: Yes.

[00:22:18] Annette: Okay, got it. So brides and overnight stays.

[00:22:22] Sarah: All right, so 2022 then. When does this start getting more adventurous?

[00:22:29] Austin: So ’21. ’21, somebody ends up talking to us at one of the small restaurants in town, said they’re looking at real estate, want to buy a house. They’re big train people. They come every year to ride the train all the time. Train people’s a thing.

[00:22:41] Annette: I know. I love these train people.

[00:22:43] Austin: I was like, well, have you thought about getting a house that you could rent on Airbnb? And they started asking me all these questions. And I was just walking them through it. And this is actually when I started listening to your podcast, and I actually kind of started freaking out because we were closed for a long time at our motel, which was really nice for the remodel, but I started panicking.

[00:23:01] I’m like, people are moving into short-term rentals. Are hotels dying? And there was all that talk at that time late ’20, early ’21. So these people call me the next week, and they’re like, so we’re going to buy a bed and breakfast and we want you to run it. And we’re like, no, we can’t do that.

[00:23:20] But we just told them what we could do basically. We got two houses right there off the bat. They bought this property that had a caretaker house and a bed and breakfast. We turned into a vacation rental. Then we did a small remodel for them as well, and then somebody was staying at our hotel, comes into the office, said they’re buying a house, wanting to put it on Airbnb.

[00:23:41] And we were like, well, who’s going to do it all for you? Karlee’s talking to him, but she’s not the salesy one either. That’s me. And they’re like, well, would you guys do it? This place is beautiful. If you’ll take care of it as good as here, then we want you to do it. And I was pretty blunt, and I was just like, it’s not mine, I’ll be honest, so I won’t take as good of care of it as this place.

[00:23:59] This is my baby. I won’t do it as nice as my own, but yeah, we’ll go for it. So ’21, we did two different owners, three homes. And then ’22, we added three, if not four. I don’t know. It’s doubled about every year over the last three years. So it went from three to six or seven, and then last summer was 11, and now it’s not going to double this year. We might add a couple, but it’ll be around 12.

[00:24:37] Annette: I want to share, Austin, you came to our membership about that time, and I just remember the first time on the call, you’re like, I don’t know. Short-term rentals are so much different than motels. I know what I’m doing with motel. I could feel the overwhelm.

[00:24:51] I think it was at that tipping point when you got to the 11 and you were like, these are two different beasts. And he was in the group asking a ton of questions and just very vulnerable that like, they are very different. And you needed help trying to figure out.

[00:25:04] Austin: Each house is a snowflake.

[00:25:07] Sarah: Yeah.

[00:25:09] Austin: You guys say that, so I’m probably copying that from you, but the motel, 16 rooms are relatively all the same. You just repeat the same thing every day. And so it doesn’t matter how many homes we manage. We will never clean a house as much as we’ve cleaned those 16 hotel rooms.

[00:25:29] I could do it with my eyes closed. And a house is so much harder. And so the systems are harder. We’ve bought an office because of that to store everything separately. We were trying to do it together. And then so as well, Karlee shared with a boutique hotel.

[00:25:44] So her parents and another partner actually came to us because they were looking at buying a boutique store that had four rooms in downtown of our home that are very high end, really nice. It was run half, somewhat bed and breakfasty, but not completely, no. He offered breakfast vouchers to a restaurant.

[00:26:02] Annette: I like that style.

[00:26:03] Austin: Yeah.

[00:26:03] Annette: Bed and breakfast vouchers. I’m here for it. I like that.

[00:26:08] Austin: They were like, we want to buy the boutique downstairs, but we do not want to run the four rooms upstairs. Can we bring you guys in as partners to do that? And so we now run those four rooms downtown. So in our town, we have a pretty high market share, and we manage a little bit of everything. Drive-up roadside motel, 12 vacation homes that can be small one bedroom apartment on a 1,600-acre ranch, large cabin, to high-end hotel room. It’s all over the place.

[00:26:42] Sarah: We get this question often, so I would just love your take on this because your products are different. Yes, it’s all hospitality, but they’re different with the boutique hotel, the motel, the vacation rentals, and the event space. Do you have social media for all of these different things?

[00:26:59] Are they all under one hospitality group, and they have their own brand? Explain to me like, how do you communicate with someone who doesn’t know you, what you do in your town, and what you offer, and do they have their own identities?

[00:27:13] Karlee: We’re actually working on this right now.

[00:27:15] Austin: It feels like a mess right now.

[00:27:17] Sarah: Yes, give it to us–

[00:27:18] Karlee: We’re trying to figure that out because, it’s definitely a huge growing pain, and it’s confusing. It’s confusing for our guests. So we’re trying to figure out the best way to do that, but it gets difficult when we have different partners and different business. So Austin and I own two of the four businesses. We are the sole owners of two of the four. And so that’s the vacation rental management company and then the event venue. The other is–

[00:27:51] Austin: The operations.

[00:27:51] Karlee: The operations of the venue. We don’t own the property. And then the other two businesses we have partners in. And so it gets a little sticky. The wedding venue is totally separate, totally on its own.

[00:28:06] Austin: That’s Karlee’s bread and butter. I’ve taken over the more lodging side of things. You’re asking this. A wedding guest, they might call me and ask me a question about the wedding, and I’m just like, stop you right there. Don’t even ask. I don’t know. Off to Karlee.

[00:28:22] Annette: You don’t say it like that, do you? We are going to–

[00:28:25] Austin: I kind of do.

[00:28:26] Annette: We’re going to have to do some– Karlee, we got you.

[00:28:39] Karlee: Thank you.

[00:28:30] Annette: I’m going to point you in the direction of my lovely wife.

[00:28:34] Austin: Yes. Because I’m like–

[00:28:35] Karlee: Fill me up.

[00:28:36] Austin: I’m like, I’m going to tell you something that is wrong, and I’m going to get in trouble for it at home, man. I know this.

[00:28:40] Annette: Yeah. We’ll workshop this later. Hot seat. Turn that in. 

[00:28:47] Austin: And people call her for the lodging, and we’re just like, no, if you want questions about weddings, you talk to Karlee. If you want questions about the hotel or lodging, talk to me– to try not to mix.

[00:28:58] Annette: Right.

[00:28:59] Karlee: And so now we are working on trying to combine the motel, the vacation rental company, and the boutique hotel. Not necessarily combine, but we just changed software to where we can have everything in one.

[00:29:15] Annette: So you can show them as you ace them all. If someone comes on, they could book at the motel. They could book at the boutique hotel. They could book with one of your own, of course. 

[00:29:22] Austin: We don’t have that part of it yet. That’s in the future.

[00:29:24] Karlee: We could do that. This system is giving us the opportunity to do that, but we’re now able to see all of it on one screen.
[00:29:34] Annette: That’s cool.

[00:29:34] Sarah: Can you share what–

[00:29:37] Austin: Yeah, we’re using Guesty.

[00:29:38] Sarah: Okay, great. And it’s working well so far?

[00:29:41] Karlee: So far, we’re in the thick of onboarding right now. They are great for vacation rentals. They’re great for the boutique hotel. They are not great for the motel, but they are the best we have seen from anywhere that can do all of it.

[00:29:59] Sarah: Yeah, I was going to say, that a special–

[00:30:01] Annette: You guys have a unique situation.

[00:30:02] Sarah: And I know some people who are trying to do all that under one and they have– that’s why I was curious, because there are different– right. Because the motel, let’s say, you want a room, and I think people like me are like, well, I want room number seven, but it doesn’t have to work like that if they’re all the same.

[00:30:21] You put them in the first available room. And so it’s that technology that a lot of the PMSs that are built for short-term rentals can’t really accommodate a motel situation. Okay, great. I’m interrupting you, but you got that going.

[00:30:34] Austin: We actually tried Hostfully.

[00:30:37] Sarah: Yeah. It didn’t work for that, right?

[00:30:38] Austin: They’re about to roll out multi-unit, and they actually spoke to us. They’re like, well, you guys, can we beta test your motel? And I was like, that’s a huge part of the multi-unit, but I’m like, we still need about 10 to 20 other things.

[00:30:52] Sarah: I feel you. Yeah.

[00:30:53] Karlee: And Guesty is closer to getting to that than anything else.

[00:30:57] Annette: Great. So they’re saying that’s on the horizon for them, which–

[00:31:01] Karlee: Yeah.

[00:31:02] Annette: Oh, that’s great.

[00:31:02] Karlee: They are on our multi-units already. 

[00:31:05] Austin: The booking engine was a big deal.

[00:31:07] Karlee: The booking engine was huge for us because we needed to be able to have the boutique hotel separate, the vacation rentals separate, and the motel separate. 

[00:31:19] Austin: Because there’s partners, you’re like, you don’t want somebody logging into Chama Trails Motel and then they book Jonah’s Cabin.

[00:31:26] Annette: Yeah.

[00:31:29] Sarah: Yeah, I get that.

[00:31:29] Austin: And so we’re like, we don’t want to steal business from ourself.

[00:31:32] Annette: That’s interesting. I want to know, is there any more cash being exchanged? What happened with the cash?

[00:31:42] Karlee: The cash is all on the books now.

[00:31:44] Austin: We have a manager at the motel now. 

[00:31:46] Karlee: Yes.

[00:31:48] Annette: Yeah, let’s go through the team. So you’re living at the motel by yourself. I’m sorry. I do have just this motel– I can see you, Karlee, like, it’s 2:00 in the morning. Someone comes up, they ring the bell, they want to get a room for the night. Does that really happen? When you guys were living there–

[00:32:04] Austin: Oh, yeah.

[00:32:04] Annette: It does. How did that impact your life? I know you were in construction and you were already doing weddings, but you are now on the job 24/7. You’re on the property. Have you ever turned off since that January 1st, 2019? What was that like? How’s that guest communication? You’re right there all the time. It’s not just texting somebody. Airbnb, it’s an app. You’re face to face. What’s that like, and how do you guys handle that?

[00:32:34] Karlee: It was really good, and it was really bad at the same time, just depending on what was going on. But I think as new business owners and new people in the business, it was really great us living on site. We learned very quickly, and we were in control of how we wanted the business to go.

[00:32:56] And so, in every single aspect, yes, you are there all the time. So you’re there all the time. Even when you don’t want to be, you’re there, but at the same time, you’re there. If there is an issue, you are there. It was definitely really difficult.

[00:33:15] Austin: There are some crazy stories.

[00:33:17] Karlee: A lot of crazy stories.

[00:33:19] Austin: We don’t even remember most of them, honestly.

[00:33:21] Karlee: Yeah.

[00:33:21] Austin: People have always been like, you guys need to write a book.

[00:33:24] Annette: That late night check-in, that’s a real thing?

[00:33:27] Austin:  All the time.

[00:33:28] Annette: They say like, do you guys have a vacancy sign, or do you have no vacancy? 

[00:33:27] Austin: Yes.

[00:33:32] Annette: Do you have a no vacancy neon? You really have a no vacancy neon? Love that. And you flip it on. But do people still come in and say, is there a room? How do they alert you?

[00:33:41] Austin: They would ring the doorbell.

[00:33:44] Karlee: They ring the doorbell. Yeah. 

[00:33:45] Annette: So if you’re sound asleep–

[00:33:47] Karlee: Yes, our house was attached to the front desk, and I don’t know how many times we woke up just scared and jump out of bed, change our clothes really quick, and then get to the front desk.

[00:33:59] Austin: Or they would call. Most of the time they’d ring the doorbell and call. Most of the time they’re good people who actually need help. A lot of it would be in snowstorms a lot. That would be a lot of them. But occasionally, you get people who you don’t want. So you just totally judge them. You look through the window without turning the lights on. You make a judgment call, and you decide whether to open the door or not. 

[00:34:24] Karlee: It was pretty easy to tell.

[00:34:25] Annette: What type of duress–

[00:34:27] Austin: If you want to open up or not.

[00:34:28] Annette: If you were in alignment with the guest and if you could accommodate them. Interesting. Karlee, I’m just imagining you like getting out of your PJs, going in and swiping someone’s credit card. So you will check people in at 2:00 AM.

[00:34:45] Karlee: Yeah

[00:34:45] Austin: Yeah. I did it 90% of the time. It’s just like, I don’t want my wife answering the door at 2:00 AM. Not a good look.

[00:34:52] Annette: Now you said you had a manager. Does a manager live there now?

[00:34:56] Austin: Yes. 

[00:34:57] Annette: I’ve always wondered how do you compensate someone if you’re providing housing. Is that part of the package?

[00:35:06] Austin: Yes.

[00:35:07] Karlee: Yes.

[00:35:07] Annette: When did you decide it’s time to move out and leave the front desk and the home?

[00:35:13] Austin: It mostly had to do with the wedding venue.

[00:35:15] Karlee: The wedding venue was growing too quickly– not too quickly.

[00:35:20] Austin: No, the pace we wanted it to.

[00:35:22] Karlee: Yeah, quicker than we had anticipated.

[00:35:23] Austin: All the businesses grew way faster than we expected. We expected to live in the motel for five years and for the wedding business to take five years to grow. We were basically closed half of 2020, and it still–

[00:35:35] Karlee: It still grew where we–

[00:35:38] Austin: Three years. 

[00:35:39] Karlee: Yeah, three years.

[00:35:40] Sarah: That’s amazing.

[00:35:41] Austin: So we did 16 weddings in 2021. [Inaudible] at the motel and running on fumes. 

[00:35:51] Karlee: We’d finish a wedding, finish cleaning up by two 2:00 AM, and then we’d be waking up at 8 o’clock to start cleaning rooms.

[00:35:58] Austin: It’s a full flip usually on a Sunday.

[00:36:00] Karlee: It was a lot.

[00:36:02] Austin: And so in September, October is usually when we have the hardest time with employees too. So there’s a couple of those 16-room turns where we don’t even have people.

[00:36:10] Karlee: We would be up doing laundry till about midnight. 

[00:36:14] Austin: Yeah.

[00:36:14] Sarah: And you have what I call probably a talent puddle, not a pond or a lake or an ocean like a lot of places.

[00:36:19] Austin: Yeah, it’s pretty tight.

[00:36:20] Sarah: It’s small, right?

[00:36:22] Karlee: Mm-hmm. 

[00:36:23] Austin: Yes. So we’ve been–

[00:36:24] Karlee: And we had our first daughter in 2020. And so we had lived in the motel for about a year and a half. And we decided it was time just with our daughter, with–

[00:36:38] Austin: Some of those late-night calls that happened.

[00:36:40] Karlee: With the business. It was all leading to, it’s time. And so we started our search in the winter of ’21, ’22.

[00:36:52] Austin: ’22, January, 2022.

[00:36:53] Karlee: January, 2022, and we got our first manager in there in February.

[00:36:57] Austin: Yeah. And we went full commitment because we bought a house before we hired.

[00:37:02] Sarah: I like that.

[00:37:03] Austin: We were like, we don’t have a choice. We’re backed into a corner where we did 16 weddings in ’21, and then in ’22 we had 26 booked. And we were like, we have to. We don’t have a choice. And that led to a not great hire. It was a good hire at the time.

[00:37:20] Karlee: It was a good hire at the time. And so they started in February or March of ’22. Live-in manager. It’s a couple with one older daughter. They’re awesome.

[00:37:33] Austin: Yeah. You mentioned small talent pool. The lady who’s now running it for us is a rockstar. She’s grown up, lived there her whole life, in the town. Her daughter worked for us, who’s now moved out. She graduated high school last year. That’s how she found out about the job. Her daughter was working for us after graduation, was like, mom, they need a new manager.

[00:37:55] Annette: I love that.

[00:37:56] Austin: Jewel is her name now. She had actually, in 2019, our first year in September, we’re in our busy time for weddings, and we have no housekeepers. And Jewel attends the wedding. And we’ve become friends with her, and she looks at Karlee at the wedding. She’s like, Karlee, you look terrible. I’m coming in tomorrow to clean. So her and her sisters just showed up and said, how can we help?

[00:38:29] Sarah: Wow.

[00:38:30] Karlee: Can we clean a couple days for you?

[00:38:31] Austin: And they got us through the end of October till the train ended. And then we’re like, all right, we’ve done our thing. We’re going back to our lives now. But for about six weeks, they all stepped in and were like, you guys needed help.

[00:38:41] Sarah: That’s incredible.

[00:38:43] Austin: And she’s now a rockstar manager.

[00:38:44] Karlee: She’s awesome.

[00:38:45] Austin: The day she came in, though, you’re talking about the small talent pool again, to bring it back, she comes in in the middle of summer. We’re panicked. It’s the middle of summer when we’re trying to hire a new manager. We have one housekeeper when our managers left. We’re like, here we go again. And Jewel gets hired. Within two weeks, we have eight.

[00:39:05] Sarah: Wow. So she’s helped you.

[00:39:07] Annette: She knows people.

[00:39:09] Austin: Yes. She made phone calls. I think we were starting to get a good reputation. We’ve always paid well. People wanted to work for us, but with Jewel, it was like, sealed the deal.

[00:39:20] Annette: She gave her stamp of approval for you two. I love that. I love that. We haven’t mentioned it, and I want to just share it because I think it’s a wonderful part of your story. Karlee, can you share the wedding venue and how that– it was your dream, but I know you and Austin, it was built for your wedding. Correct? So can you give us a little bit of that? I think it’s really beautiful that you were the first ones to get married there. Right?

[00:39:47] Karlee: Yes. So my grandfather had this property. He bought it back in the ’70s, had the log home built in the ’80s. And so I grew up always visiting Chama. Loved it. And Austin says when we talked about on our first date, our second date, that he–

[00:40:10] Austin:  First date, she was like, my grandfather owns this property in Chama. It’ll make the most beautiful wedding venue, right on the river. And I’m living in Colorado at the town. There ain’t no way I’m ever moving to New Mexico. And the first time they took me down there, it’s beautiful. It is up in the mountains. It looks just like Colorado. 

[00:40:24] And the first time we drove down there when we were dating, I was like, when are we moving? Because this is heaven. It’s beautiful. 

[00:40:32] Karlee: And so then we got engaged in 2017, and my parents had talked about building a barn on the property for a while. And our wedding was the push to build it. So then Austin and my dad built this barn on the property, did the final touches the Wednesday before the wedding. And we had the first wedding in 2017. And then opened up for business in 2019.

[00:40:59] Annette: How many of your wedding guests stay at the motel and the rentals? Has that been a really nice– no pun intended– marriage between those businesses and being able to– you said it’s remote, so I’m sure that helps for your bookings. Correct?

[00:41:15] Karlee: Absolutely. It definitely does. And I think it helps that they know us, they trust us.

[00:41:22] Austin: I think it makes those people feel comfortable because a lot of times on the ranch, on the wedding tours, people are like, it’s South of town, and most of our people touring the wedding venue are coming from South, so they don’t arrive in town, and they’re just like, we haven’t seen a town.

[00:41:36] Karlee: Where is everybody going to stay?

[00:41:38] Austin: In an hour and a half. Where are people going to stay? And so to offer that. And then people see the ranch and how beautiful it is, and they’re like, well, if you guys own this, then we trust whatever else it is you guys are doing.

[00:41:52] Annette: Oh, love that. How far is the wedding venue to the motel specifically? 

[00:41:57] Karlee: Four miles.

[00:41:58] Annette: Oh, perfect.

[00:42:00] Karlee: Yeah, really close.

[00:42:02] Austin: Which we all [Inaudible] to show.

[00:42:03] Annette: See, you guys can do all the things.

[00:42:05] Sarah: How do you get paid? Especially since there’s different owners with different sections of the business, does each business cut you a check? Are you salary? How’s that working? Have you figured it out at this point?

[00:42:20] Karlee: Yeah, so all of our businesses are the LLCs. And I’m saying in New Mexico, you can’t actually be on payroll of you’re an owner.

[00:42:26] Annette: You cannot, is that what you said?

[00:42:28] Karlee: Cannot.

[00:42:30] Austin: You have to take a draw. 

[00:42:32] Karlee: And so it’s only a draw. And so the two businesses that we fully own are the two businesses that basically pay our living wage.

[00:42:42] Annette: Okay.

[00:42:43] Austin: So the ranch, the wedding venue, and then the vacation rental management.

[00:42:47] Karlee: And then the other businesses, we just look at what the profit was at the end of the year and do a draw based on that.

[00:42:57] Annette: Interesting.

[00:42:58] Austin: Yeah, everybody the same.

[00:42:59] Karlee: Yes. And so the two businesses that do pay us, it still comes out as an owner draw, not a salary or anything. So we have to save a lot of money for taxes.

[00:43:09] Austin: It also depends. I will say in the past, it has depended on the year in which business we are choosing to grow.

[00:43:16] Annette: Oh, that’s a great point.

[00:43:16] Sarah: Yeah. Yes, you’re in the same city and you guys are in the same industry, but serial entrepreneurs with all these different verticals within this space that I imagine that being one of the hurdles you had to figure out. My next question is, there’s a lot of talk right now in social media world about motels, and I feel like it’s because we’re getting out of the whole post-COVID situation where short-term rentals and Airbnbs are incredible. 

[00:43:46] You can do no wrong. You can buy in any market. It’s so easy. And then it gets a little tougher. And like you said, with the vacation rentals, every house is a snowflake. Every guest is a snowflake. The cleaning protocols are different. And so now there’s a lot of talk about motels, and now that’s the answer.

[00:44:01] Getting a motel, and everything’s the same. And so now it’s motels. Screw the short-term rentals. You guys do it all. What do you say? Is it all hard? Is it like, choose your hard? Is it if you could buy another, what’s your next purchase going to be because of what you know? I just feel like you guys are the source of truth when it comes to this because you’ve done it all.

[00:44:21] Karlee: I think we would preface with that as we have been in all business too. So I thinks there’s a lot of fluff. Motels are sparkly. They’re fun. They’re great. They’re passive. They are not. You have to be in it. You have to really work it. And that has–

[00:44:44] Austin: You get to have money or time. One of the two. If you have plenty of money, then yeah, you can buy one. You can pay somebody to do it all.

[00:44:51] Karlee: If you don’t, it’s a lot of sweat, a lot of tears. And because of that though, we would do a motel.

[00:45:02] Sarah: Okay. Got it.

[00:45:02] Austin: I think, too, it’s very market pending. It’s very market determinant. In our market, we got a deal on the motel. We manage homes for people that are buying a home for almost the same price that we bought the motel, and our motel will do 15X in revenue.

[00:45:24] Sarah: Wow. Yeah.

[00:45:27] Austin: I see those numbers, and I’m like, it’s no brainer. Hotel-motel, we’ve been talking a lot about it. Some of the people that we are now managing for are people that I do believe we could call to be like, hey, we’re looking at buying such and such property. Would do you want in?

[00:45:49] Annette: Got you.

[00:45:51] Austin: Started build reputation with our owners.

[00:45:53] Sarah: I bet.

[00:45:53] Annette: I feel like you’re going to take over this town.

[00:45:55] Sarah: I know. You’ve already taken over.

[00:45:57] Karlee: We won’t do anymore in this town.

[00:45:58] Austin: Yeah. We’re done.

[00:46:01] Annette: Oh, that’s interesting. My last question about division of time, of labor, you spoke to having full-time and part-time employees. My mind just goes to, okay, well, some of them are cleaning at the motel and then they’re going to go to the boutique hotel, then they’re going to go to a vacation rental and then, heck, they might even go over to the wedding venue to help set up. How do you break down payroll for all of these different places or do you even have that big of a–

[00:46:30] Karlee: You’re going to have to ask us again in about three months. 

[00:46:33] Annette: Because you’re not doing that yet. Okay, fair enough.

[00:46:35] Austin: That was part of the Guesty thing.

[00:46:37] Karlee: That was part of Guesty, is we’re trying to put it all on one system to where we can manage it all, and so we can scale the vacation rental business. Because we just felt stuck where we were.

[00:46:50] And we have all our employees for the motel, and there are some that only want to work there, which is great. And then there’s a couple that are willing to bounce around. And then we have one, maybe two that’s only going to be for the vacation rental company.

[00:47:05] Austin: And in the past, we’ve burned out employees. Because like you said, sit’s so confusing. And they’re just like, they feel like, well, I have no idea what I’m doing when I show up at work today.

[00:47:16] Annette: They feel jerked around.

[00:47:17] Austin: Because we’re running around like that when we live there. And so like, you got two rooms at the motel today. We need you to go here and clean this house. I’ve never even been there. You can figure it out.

[00:47:28] Sarah: Yeah.

[00:47:29] Annette: Oh, my final question is, how is it working together? You guys have a lot of different businesses. It’s a small town, two kids. It sounds like when you guys got together originally, this was not part of the plan. You had two separate jobs. But give us an insight into like, what is that like? Is it beautiful? Is it hard? Is it both? What can you offer to our listeners about this dynamic?

[00:47:56] Austin: I’d say it’s a lot easier now than it was when we started. From the get go though, you said we’re in the honeymoon phase and bought a motel. The house we moved into when we got married, we had one bedroom ready when we moved in, and then the rest was a near gut remodel. So it’s been that way from day one.

[00:48:16] Sarah: It is just life.

[00:48:17] Karlee: And I think working together, I wouldn’t have it any other way. There’s days when we see each other at breakfast and lunch and we’re like, what are up to? I feel like I haven’t talked to you all day. It’s weird. And so I wouldn’t have it any other way. There are days that I want to just smack them.

[00:48:37] Austin: I think at this point, we’ve just figured out our roles more like when we’re at the wedding venue, she hates it when I tell people, and I’m like, I work here. Karlee’s in charge. I work here. And it’s, yes, ma’am. What needs to be done? And I don’t like being told what to do.

[00:48:56] Neither of us do. We’re entrepreneurs. So that’s usually where, if we’re getting on each other, it’s usually like, I say, yes, I’m an employee at the ranch, and then I start giving my opinion, and she’s like, just get it done.

[00:49:11] Sarah: You guys are cute.

[00:49:12] Austin: But it’s fun. We’ve learned things the hard way too.

[00:49:16] Karlee: Definitely.

[00:49:17] Austin: But I wouldn’t do it any other way. It’s so much fun. We’re like, I can’t imagine just saying hi at the end of the day and bye in the morning and being like, all right, we get four or five hours and go to bed and do it again the next day.

[00:49:31] Karlee:  But I also know that it is not for everyone at all, and that’s totally fine.

[00:49:39] Austin: Especially with our kids, it’s cool. Our kids do. They have been overexposed to our lifestyle. We’ve cleaned rooms with babies on our chest. We’ll set up the pack and play in the middle of the wedding venue while we’re getting the wedding venue ready with guests there, and they’re screaming.

[00:50:02] You just push through. But we’re like, same thing with Karlee and I being together. We spent so much more time with our kids than otherwise. So I can’t imagine doing another way. 

[00:50:17] Karlee: No, me either.

[00:50:16] Sarah: There’s something really authentic about that. And you say it’s a family-owned business, and it’s like, no, truly, the whole family is here, and we’re doing everything to make it work. Where can our listeners reach out to you or find out about all the different things you got going on out there? Where’s the best place to send them?

[00:50:35] Karlee: Probably our website. Website.

[00:50:37] Austin: Which one?

[00:50:38] Karlee: See, this is the tricky part.

[00:50:40] Sarah: It’s okay.

[00:50:41] Karlee: We should have it all under one.

[00:50:42] Sarah: We’ll give it all in the show notes, but name them off.

[00:50:44] Annette: Yeah, just name them all, and we’ll link them off.

[00:50:48] Karlee: You got it, chamatrailsmotel.com. Instagram’s also @chamatrailsmotel. Turquoise Antler, Short-Term Rentals, that’s going to be chamavacationrentals.com.

[00:51:00] Sarah: That’s a good URL. Okay.

[00:51:02] Karlee: And then the lofts at Sterling and Sage, that is sterlingandsage–

[00:51:09] Austin: chama.com.

[00:51:10] Karlee: sterlingandsagechama.com. And then the wedding venue to wrap it all up is Log River Ranch, and logriverranch.com, as well as Instagram’s @logriverranch.

[00:51:22] Annette: Hey, at least you got them.

[00:51:24] Sarah: Can you even wrap your mind around that? You guys built all this since 2019. It is only 2024. Can you even?

[00:51:30] Karlee: It’s pretty amazing. But we were blessed with so much to begin with.

[00:51:36] Sarah: I know.

[00:51:38] Karlee: It definitely is not on our own. 

[00:51:41] Austin: These things didn’t grow. We talk about 2021 and those years of like staying up till 2:00 AM, working the wedding venue, and then being up till midnight cleaning the motel, we were not growing at those times. But we have awesome people. 

[00:51:58] Karlee: We have great people that work with us. Again, we were blessed with so much from the very beginning. That’s the only reason why we are here where we are today. 

[00:52:09] Austin: Yes.

[00:52:10] Sarah: I love that.

[00:52:11] Austin: Other people.

[00:52:12] Karlee: Yes.

[00:52:13] Sarah: And recognizing your network and those that support you is a huge part of that growth. But we are honored that you’re in the Thanks for Visiting community. So it’s been a pleasure sharing your story today, and we cannot wait to see what you two accomplish just in this next year. You’re going to get all figured out. You’re going to get somewhat organized, but there’s always going to be something to do. That’s the beauty of entrepreneurship. With that, I am Sarah Karakaian.

[00:52:37] Annette: I am Annette Grant. And together we are–

[00:52:39] Both Annette & Sarah: Thanks for Visiting.

[00:52:40] Sarah: Talk to you next time.